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Author Topic: is FSP different?  (Read 3220 times)

MTmovement

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is FSP different?
« on: September 07, 2004, 11:47:54 pm »

is FSP different then the other projects that are out their today?  I mean their are groups of the south and west that was to Secede from America.  Their are two main ones right now that I can think of that are part of the south and one that just started up in the west.

What makes FSP different then these groups?

If these groups do split up America will that detour FSP in any way?  Meaning will it holt FSP or backsteps?

What makes FSP different?

Why choose FSP?

Thanks
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JonM

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2004, 12:31:36 am »

We want to work with people and show the world that Libertarian principles are valid methods of governance by giving them a working model.  New Hampshire had long been like that, but has suffered the indignity of immigrants who moved in and tried to make it like where they moved from.  We want to move in and help those who are resisting these other immigrants keep New Hampshire true to its roots.
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SteveA

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2004, 02:47:35 am »

Regarding other groups that might be trying something similar, though they might split some people as resources, they aren't in conflict with each other really.  I think America is being split by growing government control.  Everytime an issue (especially at the federal level) that was previously left to the people to decide is placed into a single decision made by government for all, there is left an unresolved conflict still.  Without government intervention people are more free to solve these issues on their own.  The Free State Project is primarily about minimizing the influence government has to just protecting (at most) life, liberty and property and leaving the rest up to people to voluntarily decide for themselves how to best (or not handle) handle other issues.

If another movement suceeds it actually won't hurt the FSP but bring more attention to the fact that change is actually possible when people decide it's time for a change.  I know the Christian Exodus is more focused on creating a Christian government and it's not as focused on smaller and less intrusive government.  If they succeed it would likely encourage others who are interested in smaller government to join us and see the same thing occur in N.H.  Also, at least for the Christian Exodus, they have their work cut out for them because of the size of SC.  They'd need about 50,000 people (I forget the exact number) create as much of an effect and we already have a lot of people welcoming us to N.H.  

As a quick example of how effective a group of 20,000 people can be, consider this:

Most statewide positions in the primary elections win by margins of only a few thousand votes.  Actually, with a little block voting it's not impossible to almost pick every statewide position and with a bit of activism during general elections, 20,000 people can equate to 60,000 votes or more.  N.H. has some nice political options (fusion candidates, where third parties have a much better chance to be elected and the third largest legislative body in the world that's easy to access).  N.H. also has a great history of liberty.  "Live Free or Die" is the state motto and we already have representatives that are FSP members and Governor Benson has even signed on as a friend (not actually a member but he's welcomed us and been rather friendly to many of the things FSP members have been doing in N.H.  Though not everyone will be voting in lock step, it shouldn't be too hard to swing N.H. in a much mroe libertarian direction and th main hope is that once we show it can be done, and smaller government actually offers many advantages, then others will use N.H. as an example of what can be done elsewhere.

Here's a great link for info on why N.H. was picked:

http://www.lpnh.org/101-Reasons-to-Move-to-NH.pdf

Oh, and welcome to the FSP forum :)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2004, 02:55:52 am by SteveA »
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MTmovement

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2004, 11:23:16 pm »

Okay I see it from your point of view.  I guess how I was thinking is that they might think of the FSP as a anti America if they see all of these groups spliting up America then sees FSP trying to do their thing.

Though I have been following FSP for a long time now just never bothered to sign up on the forum or with FSP.  I fight FSP very interesting and hope I enjoy my stay!
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2004, 09:19:19 am »

Keep in mind that the FSP was here first. Those Christian Exodus and Free West projects both grew out of people who saw our example but didn't agree either with our principles or with our choice of locale.

This is typical in the individualist movement, you will always find people who will say 'hell no' to anything you want to do just because they are contrarians.
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LeopardPM

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2004, 01:14:40 am »

dear MT,
I believe what you are witnessing, from the Christian Exodus to the FSP to the other freedom movements is just the beginning of what eventually will be the 'balkanization' of the US.
This is NOT a bad thing!
Fortunately, we live in a country that, at its roots, is a republic.  Basically, this means that we are 50 individual states which are in essence countries unto themselves.  The federal juggernaut has seen fit to expand its reach and powers to homogenize this symphony of states into one instrument - with powerful, but poor, results.  The intrnsic individualness that flows through us as citizens creates a breaking point in population limit that is much lower than other countries around the world.  The variety of regions and cultures within the US cannot be held together by one, all-inclusive  ideology or politcal system.
Look for California to split into to parts (North and South) and more states in the west to voice their independence and demand 'states rights' as the 'coasts' and their diferent population demographic try to impose their values and social systems in vain.
Even if states become more independent, we are all STILL americans.  We all have some very basic and fundamental beliefs which will always hold us together.  And, we will always defend each others territory from foreign invasion - doing so as a unified front.

Ask yourself this:
When you look over to your neighbors property and see them putting in a pool, or perhaps planting a vegetable garden, either of which you yourself might do vastly different - do you have any compulsion to force them to do it your way, even if you think your way is much better?  But you don't consider him to be 'unamerican' and you would probably still hire his daughter to babysit for you and might patronize his hardware store in town, right?  Same thing for the states:  even if the Christian Exodus succeeds, or the FSP, those states are still part of the union and will stand by you in national defense - but when it comes to their own state, they want to grow their gardens THEIR own way....

jump in, the water's warm!
michael
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cwelsch

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2004, 01:50:46 pm »

The FSP isn't a secessionist movement.  It exists solely to move 20,000 libertarian refugees to New Hampshire - where they can support each other and have at least a small voice.

RidleyReport

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Re:is FSP different?
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2004, 10:05:45 pm »

Leopard wrote

>>I believe what you are witnessing, from the Christian Exodus to the FSP to the other freedom movements is just the beginning of what eventually will be the 'balkanization' of the US.>>

Well as a Balkaniphile I think that's actually not the right analogy.  What is happening is more a return to Federalism, states' rights, etc.

We have unexpected allies now in a sense, with all the "blue state" people talking about secession.  But no one will ever need to secede if we return to federalism and states' rights.
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