Free State Project Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Down

Author Topic: Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?  (Read 11521 times)

dalesd

  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 13
  • Don't Tread on Me.
Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« on: March 07, 2004, 01:49:15 pm »

My wife and I were talking to her sister-in-law, who lives in NH.  She's trying to convince us to move there.  :)  This is a good thing, because I'm on board with the idea, it's my wife that'll take the convincing.  Since she's the breadwinner in our household right now, I'm not in a good position to bargain.  It'll just take some time.

Currently we live in very liberal Massachusetts.  One of the things I see repeated on this board is that simply by moving to NH, you're immediately more free than where you live now.  
Really?  Like what?  What immediate benefits could we expect?

  • No helmet law: we don't ride motorcycles. (Sometimes I wear a helmet in my car, but only for 'closed course' competition)
  • No seatbelt law: we both already wear seatbelts because we want to, not because we're forced to.
  • Better CCW laws: she abhors guns.
  • lower taxes: we both work in high-tech fields, and would likely need to find jobs in MA.  So we'd still pay MA income tax and, and also pay NH property tax.  No savings there.
So, yes, we're more free in NH, but not in any way that affects us on a daily basis as far as I can see.
I can buy into the idea that we'll work to be more free in the future, but she's going to want to see something up front.  
Please, show me something I've overlooked!
Logged
"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." ~ Henry David Thoreau
Strike the Root

SethA

  • FSP Participant
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 306
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2004, 01:59:36 pm »

The one tax you overlooked is sales tax, 0 % in NH except on restaurant food, rental cars and hotel rooms. There are high tech jobs in NH so eventually you probably won't need to work in Mass.
Logged

SteveA

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2905
  • Freedom - Are you man enough to handle it?
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2004, 02:07:03 pm »

I don't know the law in Massachusetts but there's no mandatory car insurance in N.H.

Actually, regarding the high-tech jobs, N.H. has 3 times the density of high-tech jobs compared to the rest of the nation so you wouldn't necessarily have to still work in Massachusetts.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2004, 02:08:36 pm by SteveA »
Logged
"Fruitless, born a thousand times, lies barren.  Unguided inspiration, yields random motion, circumscribed in destination, going nowhere.  Guidance uninspired, always true in facing, stands immobile.  But fixed upon that destination firmly and with inspiration lofted; beget your dreams."

atr

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 858
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2004, 02:18:57 pm »

--As voters in a much less populous state, your votes will carry more weight.

--Not how much it matters to you, but gun regulations are less restrictive in New Hampshire, and likely to get even better soon. Oops. She doesn't like guns. Well, it's still an example of how you'll become freer just by moving.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2004, 02:20:01 pm by atr »
Logged

Mike Lorrey

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2745
  • Live Free and Never Die
    • The International Libertarian
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2004, 05:05:58 pm »

seatbelts: wouldn't you feel more free simply being able to CHOOSE to wear your seatbelt, rather than HAVING to wear it?
helmets: you may not own motorcycles now, but you may choose to in the future
car insurance: beyond the fact it isn't mandatory (or because of it), insurance rates are far lower just being a NH resident
other insurance: same same
firearms: yes, your wife abhorrs them. Understood. Does she understand that the mere fact that since far more of her potential neighbors here in NH will be armed when she is not, will still make you and her far more safe than living in Mass? NH has lower crime rates than Switzerland.
I was born in Mass, and lived in a very nice section of Lowell. A upper class family that was friends with ours, that lived in Tingsboro, was assassinated in their home by a biker gang, all because MA laws prohibited their 14 year old son from being trained in handgun use. We moved to NH the next year and have not looked back.
Living in a state structured as a Republic is more freeing than in one structured as a Commonwealth. There are a myriad of differences in various ways in the legal system, in the government, that place living in NH above a place like MA.
Our large legislature ensures that you will likely know your legislator personally, and be able to directly have an effect on legislation. This is impossible in Massachusetts.
Logged
The International Libertarian: The Journal of Liberty For Everyone, Everywhere, All The Time

RidleyReport

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3548
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2004, 11:43:25 pm »

Well one advantage to moving might be that property values are likely to rise a lot over the next 15 years with the likely boom in NH that will follow reductions in government.  These reductions are well underway thanks to the local freedom movement and should accelerate as we trickle in.

Another advantage is that if there is a major catastrophe of some kind NH is one of the best places in the country to weather it.  


Logged
http://RidleyReport.com
http://NHexit.com - If Britain can do it, New Hampshire can do it

bookish_lass

  • Guest
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #6 on: March 08, 2004, 07:07:34 am »

How about lower crime rates?
Logged

Morpheus

  • Guest
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2004, 02:55:04 pm »

Would you consider your wife an intelligent woman, dalesd??
Logged

dalesd

  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 13
  • Don't Tread on Me.
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2004, 11:09:22 pm »

Would you consider your wife an intelligent woman, dalesd??

She was smart enough to marry me!     ;D  
No, wait, that might not be saying much....   :-\


Yeah, she's very intelligent.

Why?
Logged
"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking at the root." ~ Henry David Thoreau
Strike the Root

Mike Lorrey

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2745
  • Live Free and Never Die
    • The International Libertarian
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2004, 10:08:56 am »

Please don't take this the wrong way, but when an otherwise rational and intelligent person has a demonstrably visceral negative reaction to the very idea of guns, this is a mental condition known as hoplophobia.
Logged
The International Libertarian: The Journal of Liberty For Everyone, Everywhere, All The Time

Tracy Saboe

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3859
    • Rand for US Senate in Kentucky!
Re:Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #10 on: March 19, 2004, 07:21:15 pm »

Quote
car insurance: beyond the fact it isn't mandatory (or because of it), insurance rates are far lower just being a NH resident

Yeah, I've actually done some research on this in comparison with my home State in South Dakota.

South Dakota is WAY less regulated then Massachusettes is I'm sure.  But regardless, in NH Car insurence rates are about half what they are in SD. I'm sure the difference is even greater between Mass and NH.

So definetly that would probably be one area of immediate savings.

And if it's possible to get a Job in NH instead, you'd solve your MA income tax problem.

Tracy
Logged
We agree that "Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. Never for a moment should it be left to irresponsible action." --George Washington

Jack Conway

Conway Supports Obamacare
Conway Supports Cap and Trade
Conway Supports Abortion
Conway’s Utilities Rate Hike Scandal
Conway is in Bed with Big Pharma
Conway is Backed by Wall Street Bankers

citizen_142002

  • Friend of the FSP
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 490
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #11 on: June 20, 2005, 11:41:58 pm »

Vermont was actually the first "Alaska carry" state. Such a measure recently failed in the legislature, but by a razor thin margin. Better luck next time.
OK, so you don't like guns, no big deal. Are either of you smokers? Tobbacco is far cheaper in NH than in MA because of low taxes. We have some of the cheapest liqour in the nation, and that isn't about to change.
 When I travel to Massachusettes I cringe, partly because of the roads. We may still have a public road system in NH, but it is more efficient than MA. Good roads, built (somewhat) rapidly, and without he spilled coffee and worn shocks you get in MA.
Government mandated smoking bans were shot down in NH by the supreme court.
Setting up your own bussiness will be cheaper. It's cheaper for everyone else too, so you get savings as a consumer. Vehicle registration is much cheaper in NH. You need no permit to wear a gotti in public in NH.
Logged

KBCraig

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1466
Re: Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #12 on: June 21, 2005, 12:15:59 am »

Vermont was actually the first "Alaska carry" state.

Actually, we called that "Vermont carry": no license required. What's different (and more attractive) about "Alaska carry" is that no license is required in-state, but a license is available for those who wish to take advantage of reciprocity in other states.

Kevin
Logged

lloydbob1

  • Guest
Re: Will we really be more free immediately upon moving?
« Reply #13 on: July 09, 2005, 04:24:52 pm »

Dale
Just by moving to NH, you'll be in some very good company.
Logged

freedom's ideologue

  • First 1000
  • FSP Participant
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 461
    • Caleb for Congress
This is a side point ...
« Reply #14 on: July 09, 2005, 04:51:51 pm »

But I've found very, very few people who agree with me on this one.  Nonetheless, I believe it to be what the Constitution says, so I'll throw it out there:

First, the second amendment says this: 

"A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

The right is clearly stated, "the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed." 

But there is a dependent clause, "A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state"

So my conclusion is that the purpose of the right to bear arms is to engage in warfare.  Being able to stop crime or hunt are secondary benefits, they are not the purpose of the right.

Since the purpose of the right to bear arms is to engage in warfare ... it would seem to me that individuals should be able to own weapons of warfare.  Not just rifles and semi-automatic weapons.  (Those won't help me against a bomber.)  We should be allowed to own tanks, bombers, anti-aircraft weaponry, missiles, even weapons of mass destruction.

Am I reading the second amendment wrong?

Caleb

Logged
We've made too many compromises already; too many retreats. They invade our space and we fall back. They assimilate entire worlds and we fall back. Not again. The line must be drawn here! This far, no further! And I will make them pay for what they've done. - Jean Luc Picard
Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Up