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Author Topic: Maine Town to disolve intself.  (Read 68998 times)

LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #15 on: February 21, 2004, 12:43:02 am »

right you are, blefuscu! that means only $30 so far - thats 1/3rd of the way folks!!!
« Last Edit: February 21, 2004, 12:43:20 am by LeopardPM »
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atr

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #16 on: February 21, 2004, 12:04:44 pm »

here is a government monopoly (the USPS) now extending its monopolistic powers into the world of printing!  They are competing DIRECTLY with private businesses (ME! gawd darnit!) and advertising and subsidizing it with taxpayer money!  I am soooo pissed!  What can I do...anyone know... can I 'sue' the USPS?  WTF is wrong with this country... this just sent me over the edge here - forgive me, but imagine if you sold fishing rods, but everyone needs to buy a fishing license from the government - and in the fishing license departmet office they ALSO sell fishing rods... how nice and convienent!!!!!  I have NEVER (besides the insiduous taxation) been affected so directly, so 'in my face', as this...... need to calm down...

While there are many aspects to the Postal Service that qualify as subsidization, it is almost entirely funded by user fees. It's not technically a monopoly, as there are at least three other companies that you can use to mail a letter or package, not to mention that you can walk door-to-door yourself.

As a consumer, you choose to use the Postal Service for postcards because it offers the best value, so wouldn't you do the same if it offered the best value for printing?
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JonM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #17 on: February 21, 2004, 12:45:31 pm »

More than merely technically, the USPS is legally a monopoly for the delivery of First Class mail.  There are regulations specifying that private companies may not deliver packages or envelopes for less than a certain price.
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LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #18 on: February 21, 2004, 04:24:23 pm »

in addition to what Jon mentioned, it is illegal to deliver or use in any way the mailboxes on private property in front of houses - these are considered federal property even if bought/paid/placed by the homeowner.

also, the restrictions on private delivery include price (minimum $10 I think) AND that the contents be deemed URGENT and of VITAL importance - they have not pushed this regulation BUT the power to do so remains: they have the ability to open the contents of ANY privately delivered piece of mail and make a 'value' judgement on whether or not it is truely 'urgent'... pretty scarey if you ask me.

it is a federal crime if you walk 'door to door' and insert items into mailboxes.

atr, lets take a look at what you are saying:
Should the federal government offer automobiles for sale at the DMV?  Should there by government grocery stores?  its all just more 'choice', right?

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As a consumer, you choose to use the Postal Service for postcards because it offers the best value, so wouldn't you do the same if it offered the best value for printing?
wrong. as a consumer you MUST use the postal service to mail ANY postcard, irregardles of percieved 'value'.  Do you want the same for printing?
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LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #19 on: February 21, 2004, 04:28:36 pm »

BTW:  an official 'lurker' has contacted me directly and pledged another $10 so now we are, once again, back up to $40 pledged... woohoo!

all things considered, I will end this 'pledge drive' in a few days and take on whatever additional costs there are as I believe that this is a good, low-cost opportunity and has an element of 'timeliness' attached to it.... so, chip in your paltry sums folks!  But either way, there WILL be a mailing going out and NOT through the USPS sanctioned tricky low-quality printing service...

michael
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penguinsscareme

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2004, 06:40:04 pm »

Michael, I'm in for twenty.  That's ten for me & the ten I know Tracy wants to give.
But in return you have to go here http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=5694
and read my ideas (which are really great, btw)You also have to promise to get $90 in cash -- $1 bills -- and stamp them all BOTH SIDES with the freestateproject web address.  
If you don't have a stamp I'll even give you the $8 to have one made.
Fair?

Andrew
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Stamp freestateproject.org on your cash!  Stamp & inkpad run less than $10 & it's the single most effective and easy thing you can do for the fsp.  And it's legal, just don't obscure the serial #.  www.currentlabels.com

LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2004, 07:47:48 pm »

hmmm an FSP web address stamp?  OK, I will spring for one... and I agree to stamp both sides of 90 $1 bills with the stamp - but taking this idea a bit further, is this illegal?  to essentially 'deface' (vandalizism) a federal note?  or when they are in our possession are they our property?

if it is not 'illegal' than I propose that everyone should get these stamps and stamp EVERY bill they ever come into contact with!  an easy and inexpensive advertising campaign - plus it will be a hoot to receive such a bill from a bank or vendor giving change....

actually, I am also going to have the stamp say:
www.freestateproject.org
member #

(if stamping is NOT illegal)

this way if other porcs start stamping, we can receive kinda a 'message in a bottle' - "Hey I got 3 bills stamped by member #3867 - who is this and good job!" - that member is free to post "Thats me, I am in Oregon - amazing that my bills made it to Louisianna!"

michael (member #3323)
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atr

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2004, 07:57:19 pm »

There are regulations specifying that private companies may not deliver packages or envelopes for less than a certain price.

You're right. I believe the price floor is twice the cost of a first-class stamp. I stand corrected.
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penguinsscareme

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2004, 08:04:16 pm »

hmmm an FSP web address stamp?  OK, I will spring for one... and I agree to stamp both sides of 90 $1 bills with the stamp - but taking this idea a bit further, is this illegal?  to essentially 'deface' (vandalizism) a federal note?  

Ah.  See my thread here
http://forum.freestateproject.org/index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=5516

In a nutshell, it is not illegal unless you make the bill unfit for re-issue, i.e., obscure the serial numbers.

Andrew
« Last Edit: February 21, 2004, 08:26:04 pm by penguinsscareme »
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Stamp freestateproject.org on your cash!  Stamp & inkpad run less than $10 & it's the single most effective and easy thing you can do for the fsp.  And it's legal, just don't obscure the serial #.  www.currentlabels.com

atr

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2004, 08:22:06 pm »

atr, lets take a look at what you are saying:
Should the federal government offer automobiles for sale at the DMV?  Should there by government grocery stores?  its all just more 'choice', right?

This is not what I meant to imply. I only mean to suggest that using a government service is not as heinous as you make it out to be. I myself use taxpayer-funded roads, and I imagine you do, too. Sometimes governments take advantage of their road monopoly and build rest stops. Is it anti-libertarian if I stop at one to take a leak and buy a drink from the "government-sanctioned" vending machine?

Quote
Quote
As a consumer, you choose to use the Postal Service for postcards because it offers the best value, so wouldn't you do the same if it offered the best value for printing?
wrong. as a consumer you MUST use the postal service to mail ANY postcard, irregardles of percieved 'value'.  Do you want the same for printing?
No, I wouldn't want the same for printing. But, in any event, you do have a choice of what printer to use. You (and Jon) are correct to point out that laws including price floors, tax and zoning exemptions, and exclusive use of mailboxes protect the Postal Service's mail monopoly. I do not mean to endorse government monopolies or even any tax-funded government services (except for some law enforcement).
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LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #25 on: February 21, 2004, 08:22:47 pm »

excellent!  will purchase stamp on monday and start stamping away!!!  I like the 'speech balloon' idea - its cute and more prominent...
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LeopardPM

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #26 on: February 21, 2004, 08:31:25 pm »

atr,
'using' such a service is not 'wrong', but the fact that it is there at all IS wrong and we ALL pay the price for it in the end... the only possible 'wrong' from using a service is that it indirectly 'supports' the government continuing to infringe on our rights... thats all.

michael
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atr

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #27 on: February 21, 2004, 09:03:13 pm »

'using' such a service is not 'wrong', but the fact that it is there at all IS wrong and we ALL pay the price for it in the end... the only possible 'wrong' from using a service is that it indirectly 'supports' the government continuing to infringe on our rights... thats all.

Fair enough. I'll contribute $10.
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Blefuscu

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #28 on: February 21, 2004, 09:29:17 pm »

You also have to promise to get $90 in cash -- $1 bills -- and stamp them all BOTH SIDES with the freestateproject web address.  
If you don't have a stamp I'll even give you the $8 to have one made.

I wanna play.  Where do you get them made?  Can we do a bulk purchase?  What about the speech ballons?  Can they make stamps for that too?  (Just trying to cut down on the manual labor, and possibly end up with something more legible than my handwriting.)
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"Man will never be free until the last King is strangled with the entrails of the last Priest" - Denis Diderot
"I like beer and ice cream, and I have other vices too."  - Blefuscu

penguinsscareme

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Re:Maine Town to disolve intself.
« Reply #29 on: February 21, 2004, 09:44:58 pm »

Blefuscu, I got one made at a local office supply store.  I have heard you can also get them from someone in the fsp named Elizabeth, and also that you can get custom ones on ebay for $5 + s&h.  The one I had made doesn't have anything as cool as speech balloons, but it and inkpad set me back a whole ten bucks.  I don't trust my handwriting either, plus it's a lot more work that way.

One thing, though.  After the first few times the novelty wears off and it feels more like work than fun.  Don't give up!  I have some other ideas on how to have fun spreading the word, but none as simple as the money stamp.  It DOES make a difference!
One thing that really helps is to develop a really menacing-sounding laugh, and then practice it whenever you sit down with your billfold and your stamping pad.
I pay for stuff using the largest possible bill so I get the most possible back.  I love it 'cause it gets the word out across a very broad aggregate and it doesn't cost me anything (aside from the initial ten bucks, which I plan to make back in tax savings about five minutes after I move to NH).

Andrew
« Last Edit: February 21, 2004, 09:46:04 pm by penguinsscareme »
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Stamp freestateproject.org on your cash!  Stamp & inkpad run less than $10 & it's the single most effective and easy thing you can do for the fsp.  And it's legal, just don't obscure the serial #.  www.currentlabels.com
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