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Author Topic: Don't enroll your children in the public schools  (Read 25118 times)

Dawn

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Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« on: November 15, 2003, 11:58:02 pm »

When you move to NH, please don't enroll your children in the public school system. We need to raise happy, healthy, intelligent children and the best way to do that is to give them the gift of homeschooling of private schooling. Plus it will help keep the tax bills down in NH! ;)
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mark

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2003, 03:34:59 am »

How do we do this?
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Ogre11

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2003, 11:57:19 am »

I agree 100%, and I want to do this...but...

Currently I cannot for sheer financial reasons.  I'm working on it, but right now my 10-11 hour days are providing the income to pay bills.  I cannot effectively stop or reduce the hours working without massive financial penalties.

However...as part of the move to NH over the next year or three, this is one of the top priorities.  I'm currently deciding between continuing in the career area in which I am, finding a way to reduce hours without substantially reducing income (not very likely, but there are possibilities), and changing careers entirely.  One area in which I'm looking and researching is starting a homeschool (for my children and others) that will grow into a private school.  But for this to succeed, I need groups of people clustered together (for the economic base), which limits my options in NH.

Still developing, but I don't foresee my children ending up in public school in NH.
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mark

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2003, 06:17:48 pm »

Ogre, perhaps you could explore the concept of Cohousing and cooperative economics as a way to create that local economy of scale? You could provide a "landing place" for FSP migrants as well as get natives to move to a FSP town. And did you read this article by Gary North? For that new career you could start your own Daddy Daycare! Hehe.

http://www.publishers-management.com/rem/preview/
http://www.publishers-management.com/rem/preview/rr031017fb.pdf
« Last Edit: November 18, 2003, 08:10:51 pm by mark »
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Ogre11

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #4 on: November 18, 2003, 11:21:37 am »

I hadn't heard of cohousing before, although it does look very interesting.  I see many cohosing places in MA, but none in NH.  I've done a little real estate investing, so I might be in a position to work through something like this.  I'll have to check into that some more, thanks for the link!

And yes, I've seen the info about the Daddy Daycare, and I'd love to start one -- but finances stop me at the moment.  I'm debating between moving sooner with a more traditional job, or putting the move off for a year or two in order to get finances in shape so I could start a business like that, knowing there'd be no income for 3-6 months.  Of course, if I can do that, I can certainly provide not only homeschooling and daycare for incoming porcs, but potential jobs as well!
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rdeacon

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2003, 11:36:43 am »

According to the cohousing web site there is currently no cohousing community in New Hampshire.  Cheshire county is a good place for one, if somebody is enterprising enough to start one up.
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mark

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2003, 08:37:19 pm »

Here is a cohousing community in Ithaca, NY, which is a client of Brian Sullivan, the founder of the new Ithaca FSP local group.  :D

This cohousing group is no doubt part of the Ithaca progressives (like the Ithaca Hours people), but I see libertarians adapting the benefits of cohousing and intentional communities (perhaps we can call them rational communities?  ;)) to increase our self-reliance and productivity. A small academic day care (services and employment) can be combined with a cohousing community (the economic base) and this would not only avoid burdening the town's educational/employment resources, but actually reduce their burden by creating a new free market educational option for current town residents.
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kittiemeow

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #7 on: November 20, 2003, 02:18:51 am »

I am very happy to see people discussing this topic.  My husband and I are planning to make our move to NH with in the next 2 years.  We have a 4 year old son that we will not put into the public school system.  

I would be interested in relocating in an area where there are others
who are like minded and would be interested in founding a Montessori or similar non conventional community school.  We are also interested in a "settlement" type situation where people can help each other through cohousing and cooperative economics.  

I believe that more liberty minded people would be convinced to
move to NH if they knew they would have an safe "landing" spot among
others with the same beliefs.
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BlueLu

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2003, 11:31:44 pm »

Before the last major reorganization of forum topics, I posed the question of what Porcs would like to see in a private school, in terms of course offerings, location, services, etc.  I have done a couple of searches and have lost the old thread.  For some reason it was not put under Education, in the reorg.

Anyway, I was surprised at the reactions, mostly from homeschoolers, that everybody supported my idea of opening a private school with a more or less traditional academic bent (my wife and I were both trained as grade school educators), but that all the respondents were really homeschoolers or unschoolers, and so probably would not send their children to a school that, while non-coercive, really emphasized traditional academics.

What is the pulse here?  Is this a desirable thing, or are all Porcs unschoolers?  

I feel like the ideas in Jason's thread suggesting "community schools" may work some places, but there is just nothing like the control of a single mind in management over an enterprise.  I feel like the single mind is almost always preferable to management by committee, or mass-vote.

I invite your suggestions here, if this sort of school is of interest to you.
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mark

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2003, 01:03:37 am »

Did you try searching your own posting history to find that missing post?


I think formal instruction is very effective within it's limited scope. I don't see homeschoolers or unschoolers forgoing it's benefit's out of reactionary spite.

That being said, I find parents having their children raised from age 2 1/2 to age 22 by strangers as dysfunctional (simply do the math with socialization time). And factory schools are clearly unnatural and abusive. These two elements do nothing to enable a child to develop into an independent agent.

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BlueLu

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2003, 01:35:18 pm »

... I find parents having their children raised from age 2 1/2 to age 22 by strangers as dysfunctional

I absolutely agree.  My educational phylosophy is actually that the grade schools 80 years ago and back had it closer to right, when they graduated their students at 16 instead of 18.  A stated goal of our school, would be to prepare a young person to be self-sufficient by about the time they are 16.  They might go to college instead of into the workforce, but it would be expected that each matriculant would have a skill that could support them if they needed it.

And separating toddlers from their homes for more than a few of hours a day, is likewise repugnant, though we are leaving adults free to make such a choice.....  

One reason to send young children out for a few hours, is the case of many of my wife's current students, who are deaf.  Deaf children, raised in a home where the parents do not sign, will miss out on important age-specific brain development, if no one signs to them in a coherent language before the age of 4.  Many of her students will never be really conversational in a spoken or written language, because they did not get this sort of early intervention.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2003, 01:36:07 pm by BlueLu »
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TyrranzzX

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2003, 05:31:00 am »

You can always group up with other parents and choose one to teach the families kids.  I wouldn't ask any group of parents to teach any more than 5 or 6 kids as each kid needs to get their time with the parent, but you get my point.  If you've got 3 families, 6 working adults and 3-6 kids, one of the parents can take off of work and teach the kids while the other parents work.  Financially, the families can share the burden of the 1 nonworking parent.  Additionally, this'll make sure the kids have some form of a social life with their peers.

  Each kid is going to be different.  Some kids just take and can begin independantly learning needing to stop here and there for help.    Others need some motivation or they'd rather be out smelling the flowers, so to speak.  For them, mabye bookwork isn't a good idea and more hands on activities are a good idea.  Why learn WW2 warfare from a book when you can play call of duty?

Additionally, as they get older their interests are going to take form.  Some of them are going to want to learn how to build a computer, while others will want to learn to build a house.  Apprenticeship is a good way of doing things.  One of the parents from one of the other families can take the kid to work a couple times a week, providng the employer is willing, and show them the way the job works and how to build a house.  

As for state requirements, talk about a low low bar.  Most kids, so long as you keep them away from overstimulation, are naturally inquisitive.  And as long as you give them an outlet for their curiosity, they'll go real far.  At some point your kid will ask you "how does the moniter work" and you can sit down with a book with em' for a few hours and teach them.

And as for how kids should be taught, since we're not talking about ignorant people for the most part doing this, they should spend some time educating themselves.  It really depends on family to family and bickering over some standard is silly.  I would, however, work with other I guess "groups" of families teaching their kids to share ideas and reading material.  From this you can reach a semi-standard of information so new parents aren't running all over the place reading lots of useless info.  Everyone's going to have their own interpretation and own way of doing things, and groups will have disagreements.

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mark

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2003, 05:50:12 am »

Good points TyrranzzX.  :D  I think self-reliant, co-operative community schooling is the way to go. And those first 3 families will make it easier for the next 3 families (and then the next 3... ) to choose a more natural, rational schooling choice rather than using the crutch of the "free" government daycare.
Hmmm... I wonder how many "libertarians" actually boycott gov schools? I wonder how many FSP members do? There must be something a core group of FSP activists could do to make the choice of opting-out easier.  :-\
« Last Edit: December 22, 2003, 05:50:24 am by mark »
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Margot Keyes (SUNSHINE)

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2004, 05:31:44 pm »

Hi everybody!  I am so pleased to finally have some time to search this part of the site.  

My two daughters are in a Montessori preschool right now and though it is housed in a church there is ABSOLUTELY NO link to it in thought or action.  I firmly believe in Maria Montessori's method of allowing the child to direct his own learning within the scope of a well- organized arena with tangible manipulatives that enable him a "hands-on" way of learning.  Listening to lecture was no more fun in college than it was when we were wee ones.  

I also have 16 month old twins who will most likely not be able to be enrolled in this Montessori school here as we will be in the process of moving to NH.

I firmly believe that we can get around some of the homeschooling law restrictions of NH, appeal to those who don't want to homeschool their children nor send them off to become mindless automotons in the public schools.  

We need to work on this idea of a barter school system.  Those of you with degrees or experience in child schooling and child rearing can be the forerunners.  We need organizers.  We need MINIMAL administrative personnel. And we need a location.  The thought of a living, working, learning community is outstanding.  Wasn't that how it was all done in long times past?  Now with the internet, we certainly can keep our groups small and manageable but also have the world at our fingertips!!  Maybe we can work with existing library systems to have a new branch in a newly developed area that could also house our school?  

Perhaps we need to get a few of us together who really want to make this happen for our children and see where it can go!  I never felt qualified for homeschooling but I know several people who are involved in it and it seems much more like a cooperative effort of several families more than one sequestered nuclear unit holed up in their home away from the community.

My father was educated in a rural one-room schoolhouse in PA, went on the Penn State and worked for 30 years moving up the corporate ladder in his chosen field very effectively and happily.  IT CAN BE DONE!!!

Who else wants to give it a try???

best to all--SUNSHINE
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silverfish

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Re:Don't enroll your children in the public schools
« Reply #14 on: January 13, 2004, 01:50:46 pm »

Sunshine, my wife and I have been discussing NH, and opening up a Montessori school out there. Not sure what is going to happen, I haven't officially joined FSP, however I continue to lurk here in the forums.

The Gary North article (which I see you have participated in the forum thread on) has got my wife thinking alot. This coupled with the fact that she was the business manager of the Montessori that my kids (4 of them from Primary to Upper Elementary) go to has her thinking that it can be done, and that NH may be the place to do it.
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Mr.Madison (Green), what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it.
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