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Author Topic: NH almost the least religious state  (Read 21313 times)

John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #45 on: May 16, 2014, 12:59:49 am »

My point being is that by the various postings, I would presume that atheists must have been in charge in the 18th and 19th centuries.
But your post informs me of the history a little bit better.
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dalebert

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #46 on: May 16, 2014, 08:20:45 am »

...Christian theologians taking the (scripturally-accurate) position that abortion should be avoided, but because it "encourages promoscuity,"

We all really know that's still the reason. Come on. More specifically, they don't want people to avoid the consequences of their "sin".

dalebert

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #47 on: May 17, 2014, 08:20:38 am »

This video just came out and it reminded me of your comment.

Is Christianity Moral?

... but religion as a whole is more about morality then it is about the stories themselves.

I would encourage folks to watch some of his other videos. The animation is very early years South-Parky (he's clearly not an artist) but it works and he puts a lot of research and effort into them.

A couple screenshots for folks who don't bother watching (it's only 5 mins):



John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #48 on: May 17, 2014, 02:18:43 pm »

This video just came out and it reminded me of your comment.

Is Christianity Moral?

... but religion as a whole is more about morality then it is about the stories themselves.

I would encourage folks to watch some of his other videos. The animation is very early years South-Parky (he's clearly not an artist) but it works and he puts a lot of research and effort into them.

A couple screenshots for folks who don't bother watching (it's only 5 mins):




Actually God forbade us to have a 'death row' - it was a lesson after Cain committed the first murder.
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Planethosting

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #49 on: May 17, 2014, 05:16:13 pm »

Some general comments.

Liberals, especially environmentalists, are extremely religious.  Their religion is secular.  And they are very statist in orientation.  They literally worship the government.  The people that liberals, and many libertarians, called religious conservatives, are in my view hardly that religious at all.  It's all superficial.  They've thrown in the towel.  They have pro-military sermons.  They don't believe in good and evil anymore.  They accept the secular religion of Psychiatry which has replaced good and evil with mythical concepts like mental health and mental illness.  True Christians, Muslims and adherents to Judaism (not the same as Jews) should be radical in their devotion to liberty.
So you believe that no religion is based on the environment? And liberals supported same-sex marriage and choice because they are in opposition to liberty?

I really don't understand your first question.  And no, I don't believe liberals support same-sex marriage and choice (I assume you mean abortion) because of a devotion to liberty.  They support the former because they are egalitarians and reactionaries.  They support legalized abortion because they think its some sort of sexism and/or they are reacting to what they perceive as an anti-female oppressive religious based attitude.  They don't really think a woman owns their body.  If they did, they would be libertarians.

Who owns the woman (or male) inside the woman's body?
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From Babylon, to Samaria, to Egypt, to now Rome, with the aid of The City of London, the District of Columbia, and hooded spirits such as the one they call Lucifer...we are being ruled spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and then physically.  Less so if you understand the true source, nature, and techniques of 'spell casting' by our oppressors.  We are defeated in the spirit realm, first, because many don't believe in the power of, or understand, such things...unlike our rulers, who are the most powerful spiritual organization on the planet, and represent the absolute darkness and proliferation of the occult.

dalebert

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #50 on: May 17, 2014, 07:41:03 pm »

Who owns the woman (or male) inside the woman's body?

Can you please do the courteous thing and move your abortion discussion to a thread where it's on topic? You can start a new thread if you need to.

Meanwhile, discussion of this specific topic (NH almost the least religious state) is now up on YouTube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wMvoVL6A8LE

John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #51 on: May 18, 2014, 12:35:57 am »

They could. But what they are discussing is based on their religious beliefs... which should they move to NH would be carried with them.
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Argentum

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #52 on: May 18, 2014, 08:06:48 am »

They could. But what they are discussing is based on their religious beliefs... which should they move to NH would be carried with them.


I assume you realize that there are libertarians who base their objection to abortion on science and philosophy, not religion.  There is http://www.l4l.org/.
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MaineShark

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #53 on: May 18, 2014, 08:53:04 am »

I assume you realize that there are libertarians who base their objection to abortion on science and philosophy, not religion.  There is http://www.l4l.org/.

Not really.  For example, "4. A prenatal child has the right to be in the mother's body" is totally incorrect.  There's no foundation within libertarian philosophy for that claim, which is integral to their argument.  They just made it up, without support.

Since there's no actual philosophical basis for their arugment, it's clear that it's just a thinly-veiled excuse for religious groups to try and put their position over on others.  Fortunately, there are many libertarians who are both religious, and honest enough to admit that their opposition to abortion is religious in nature and, therefore, that they have no right to attempt to enforce it upon others.  Since they're honest about it, that un-ties their hands and allows them to advocate intelligently for their position, attempting to convince others rather than force others to comply.

Statistically, allowing abortion makes abortion rarer, in the same way that Prohibition increased alcohol-related carnage instead of reducing it, or how suicide rates go down in jurisdictions that allow assisted suicide.  The latter example is particularly-comparable.  If someone is up against a deadline, whether that be a cut-off after which abortions cannot be obtained, or facing down the potential that s/he will be suffering but have degraded to the point that suicide is impossible without help, there's pressure to make the decision, before that point.  So, when there's less pressure, the decision is more likely to follow a "wait and see" attitude.  The longer a woman carries an unborn child, the more likely she is to decide that she wants to give it a chance in the world, just as the longer someone ill waits, the more likely it is that they will either find that there's a treatment option that is working, or that they degrade so quickly that it's irrelevant - few actually end up in that "years of pain" scenario, but it's scary enough to drive folks facing it to suicide, if they think they won't be able to manage it later.

Those who oppose abortion (or suicide) but who rationally - rather than religiously - examine the situation will realize that legalization will actually help them in their goal of reducing the abortion rate.  Legalizing it and treating it as a social issue instead of a criminal one (like drug abuse, for yet another example) is the way to end up with less abortion.  Someone not blinded by religion will see that.

There are plenty of folks who are religious, but not blinded by their religion, but there are always a substantial percentage who are blinded by their religion.  Ergo, less religion and more rationality tends to lead towards more liberty.
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #54 on: May 18, 2014, 05:35:36 pm »

They could. But what they are discussing is based on their religious beliefs... which should they move to NH would be carried with them.


I assume you realize that there are libertarians who base their objection to abortion on science and philosophy, not religion.  There is http://www.l4l.org/.
The topic under the title is 'NH almost the least religious State'; so a basis on science and philosophy would be less on-topic than one about religious belief.
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #55 on: May 18, 2014, 05:41:13 pm »

Some general comments.

Liberals, especially environmentalists, are extremely religious.  Their religion is secular.  And they are very statist in orientation.  They literally worship the government.  The people that liberals, and many libertarians, called religious conservatives, are in my view hardly that religious at all.  It's all superficial.  They've thrown in the towel.  They have pro-military sermons.  They don't believe in good and evil anymore.  They accept the secular religion of Psychiatry which has replaced good and evil with mythical concepts like mental health and mental illness.  True Christians, Muslims and adherents to Judaism (not the same as Jews) should be radical in their devotion to liberty.
So you believe that no religion is based on the environment? And liberals supported same-sex marriage and choice because they are in opposition to liberty?

I really don't understand your first question.  And no, I don't believe liberals support same-sex marriage and choice (I assume you mean abortion) because of a devotion to liberty.  They support the former because they are egalitarians and reactionaries.  They support legalized abortion because they think its some sort of sexism and/or they are reacting to what they perceive as an anti-female oppressive religious based attitude.  They don't really think a woman owns their body.  If they did, they would be libertarians.

Who owns the woman (or male) inside the woman's body?
No one.
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dalebert

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #56 on: May 18, 2014, 06:00:33 pm »

They could. But what they are discussing [abortion] is based on their religious beliefs... which should they move to NH would be carried with them.

He just seemed to be arguing against legal abortion while Maineshark actually discussed it in a manner that made it relevant to the topic.

Planethosting

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #57 on: May 18, 2014, 06:40:10 pm »

Regarding the callous crusading attitudes towards abortion; I believe this is part of the American culture, to crush and destroy the weak and helpless, for our own convenience, and fortune.  American Indians were exterminated.   Racial genocide is being committed against the African America population, via the 'war on drugs' ethnic cleansing, welfare - which is to African Americans what alcohol was to the Indians, oh yeah - and they do have alcohol, too, and a nifty invention called "crack"; where one in four are incarcerated in 'reservations' (a phenomenon made possible by US Government's social engineering which set out to do the same).
 
So, who is that blob in the belly? They may not be red, or brown, but they are sure to stupid to be fully developed or independent, yet.
 
The American culture is a luciferian one.  "Do as Thou Wilt".
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From Babylon, to Samaria, to Egypt, to now Rome, with the aid of The City of London, the District of Columbia, and hooded spirits such as the one they call Lucifer...we are being ruled spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and then physically.  Less so if you understand the true source, nature, and techniques of 'spell casting' by our oppressors.  We are defeated in the spirit realm, first, because many don't believe in the power of, or understand, such things...unlike our rulers, who are the most powerful spiritual organization on the planet, and represent the absolute darkness and proliferation of the occult.

MaineShark

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #58 on: May 18, 2014, 07:04:16 pm »

Regarding the callous crusading attitudes towards abortion; I believe this is part of the American culture, to crush and destroy the weak and helpless, for our own convenience, and fortune.

Agreed.  The crusaders against abortion always target the weakest and most helpless.  And they are utterly callous - they're happy to yell epithets at rape victims, or vote to have the government assault women, but few if any will lift a hand to help that same rape victim with the costs of pregnancy or the difficulties of raising the child once it's born.  All they care about is badgering her into keeping it, but what kind of life can she give that child without help, which those who badgered her won't provide?

It's all about their convenience.  Abortion offends them (as it does me), but the most convenient way for them to deal with that is to support politicians who will ban it, and such.  Simple and easy - maximum self-righteousness, with minimum investment of time, energy, or money.  Actually helping a woman through her pregnancy and helping her care for the child, so she won't feel trapped into an abortion is hard - who wants to invest all that time and effort, when you can just have some cop assault her, instead?

Rational opponents of abortion realize that government is not the answer - the oppose restrictions on abortion, and favor helping mothers and children.  Religious opponents of abortion just go to the quick&easy option of, "have the government do it" and leave it at that...
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: NH almost the least religious state
« Reply #59 on: May 18, 2014, 07:33:12 pm »

Regarding the callous crusading attitudes towards abortion; I believe this is part of the American culture, to crush and destroy the weak and helpless, for our own convenience, and fortune.  American Indians were exterminated.   Racial genocide is being committed against the African America population, via the 'war on drugs' ethnic cleansing, welfare - which is to African Americans what alcohol was to the Indians, oh yeah - and they do have alcohol, too, and a nifty invention called "crack"; where one in four are incarcerated in 'reservations' (a phenomenon made possible by US Government's social engineering which set out to do the same).
 
So, who is that blob in the belly? They may not be red, or brown, but they are sure to stupid to be fully developed or independent, yet.
 
The American culture is a luciferian one.  "Do as Thou Wilt".
Though it is a little off topic. Natives still exist; they weren't exterminated. Libertarians don't support the 'war on drugs' (especially as it advocates for imprisonment); and most people on 'welfare' are not African-American.

You still haven't made a point on that 'blob in the belly".
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