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Author Topic: Electrical Pollution  (Read 23521 times)

d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #30 on: September 13, 2013, 12:17:24 pm »

Ah, ok.

Yes, actually, I'm very aware of the majority's unintentional complicity. It's a circular problem, to be sure. I'm more bothered, though, by the actions of the minority, because their complicity is intentional.

An example of the circularity and weight of responsibility would be:
In order to have a functioning constitutional republic, the people need to participate in the processes of government -- "of the people, by the people".
But in order to participate, the people need to be educated in the processes of government and need to be motivated to do so, by their understanding of how participation benefits them.
So the ones whose complicity is intentional set up the U.S. Department of Education (socialist) to make sure that that the rest don't receive knowledge of governmental processes in the normal course of their education, and put their money and influence to work in the (highly centralized) mass media to make sure that the rest grow up focused on consumption and entertainment rather than anything important and meaningful, like the processes of the government under which one lives.

Sure, when it comes right down to it, each one is responsible for himself. But it is a fact that we humans are highly susceptible to psychological conditioning.

So who bears more responsibility for this sorry state of affairs in which the human race finds itself? The majority who unknowingly allow it, or the minority who deliberately create it? My heart says the latter.

As for constitutional authority... Yes, I understand what your words mean; but, if you think that the Constitution has provided authority to do what they have done, then I can only think that your understanding of that document and mine are fundamentally different.

I will just note that wise adjudicators throughout history have repudiated the notion that any body of written laws can ultimately be relied upon. That is why the tradition of unwritten, "common" law was maintained despite our transition from British subjects to American people.

The problem of "law" is a very deep one.

---

MaineShark: thanks for that! (LOL) Reading that post was like watching Muhammed Ali beat up Buckwheat. I love when another one of those fill-the-Internet-with-nonsense people gets (intellectually) gored!

I'd ask for a match between you and Tet next, but he's an android. (Come on, tell me he's not! It's not an insult; it's an observation.)

Now I'm off to reverse-engineer a brilliant piece of software written by a Russian who apparently thought a few incoherent paragraphs were adequate documentation for it. (Grrr!) See ya l8r, alligators...
« Last Edit: September 13, 2013, 12:31:38 pm by djsmith »
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #31 on: September 13, 2013, 03:35:16 pm »

The DOE wasn't set-up for the purpose your suggesting.
Lack of knowledge about the functioning of government is general ignorance (that we all have to some degree), this can be because a lack of the subject being brought up or the failure of the individual to pay attention to it.

If the minority had been paying attention; it might have done more to prevent the development of a Department with questionably constitutional grounds.

In NH, it was pretty simple. Present it to the People as a means to keep property taxes down, and don't mention that it will be paid for with other taxation/borrowing and never mention the constitution.

I see it all the time for programs that are developed. That Paul Amendment trying to end one such program. And the most important of the four Paul Amendments, because I suspect that it will be attacked from all sides.
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d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #32 on: September 14, 2013, 10:13:44 am »

I freely admit to not knowing anything very specific about the historical event that was the setting up of the Department of Education, therefore you may be right about my being wrong about the motivations behind it.

However, it is a program of socialism, something better left in more private hands. Whether by design or by later corruption, its effect is as I've described. For example, I went to a public high school with relatively high standards, and political education consisted of a single semester course, which was an elective. <sarcasm>I can surely see how learning geometric proofs and algebraic equations are so much more important to the average person's life that several years of them are mandatory but a half-year of 'Government' isn't.</sarcasm>

Do you seriously hold everyone up to the expectation that they will fight against every stream of consciousness which has been grooved into their minds by their environment and figure out the contrary truth? After all, the planet hasn't ever, to our knowledge, seen such an enlightened majority. I think that's an unrealistic expectation in the current social environment. I once thought that way myself, but eventually realized it was just an ego-driven attitude. Those who are in the dark need someone to provide them light, not for someone to curse their blindness and say, "Well, just stumble around and hurt yourself, then, stupid!"
« Last Edit: September 14, 2013, 02:32:24 pm by djsmith »
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #33 on: September 14, 2013, 05:18:53 pm »

I expect that most will stand up to only those violations of the constitutional republic that concerns them.
But they will also support violations of the constitutional republic that concerns them.

So it only takes a very small minority to keep the balance, regardless of the majorities decision to ignore it.

Rand Paul entered four amendments to that bill, two might find little opposition, while two will find opposition, and only one is technically correcting a questionable act under the Constitution.

Removing Davis-Bacon for Transportation and HUD projects will probable get as much political opposition as removing funding for Transportation Alternative Programs. Davis-Bacon is bad from a libertarian sense, but its not a violation of the Constitution if the contracts are toward items empowered to the Congress. The TAP programs are questionable in that empowerment.
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d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #34 on: September 14, 2013, 08:49:34 pm »

Well, since it's proving impossible to draw you out on the subject of underlying principles... then I have a request. Could you give me a brief summary of what Sen. Paul's amendments to S. 1742 are about?

I tried looking them up earlier (and noticed the extreme opposition he's receiving to the TAP amendment -- mostly from state welfare junkies, it seems), but I literally don't have the time to delve into this in any detail at the moment.

If you don't mind doing that, I suggest starting a new thread for it, so as not to continue cluttering Mr. Adams' discussion of electrical pollution.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: September 14, 2013, 08:56:04 pm by djsmith »
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Sam Adams

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2013, 07:51:21 pm »

 DJ, glad you mentioned Primary Cell Perception. Clive Backster, if I have his name right, former CIA polygraph founder and expert. he found that plants with attached electro, s attached feel pain and feelings. Electricity is within all living things, species and animals. Electricity is within living cells that communicate, but its low frequency just like our smart meters and cell phones and towers.
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MaineShark

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #36 on: September 15, 2013, 08:15:45 pm »

DJ, glad you mentioned Primary Cell Perception. Clive Backster, if I have his name right, former CIA polygraph founder and expert. he found that plants with attached electro, s attached feel pain and feelings. Electricity is within all living things, species and animals. Electricity is within living cells that communicate, but its low frequency just like our smart meters and cell phones and towers.

Of course, no one else has ever been able to replicate his "experiments" with scientific controls.
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2013, 08:40:52 pm »

How do you know its the same frequency? And if it was, when you get a burst from any of it, why don't you convulse?
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #38 on: September 15, 2013, 08:49:45 pm »

Well, since it's proving impossible to draw you out on the subject of underlying principles... then I have a request. Could you give me a brief summary of what Sen. Paul's amendments to S. 1742 are about?

I tried looking them up earlier (and noticed the extreme opposition he's receiving to the TAP amendment -- mostly from state welfare junkies, it seems), but I literally don't have the time to delve into this in any detail at the moment.

If you don't mind doing that, I suggest starting a new thread for it, so as not to continue cluttering Mr. Adams' discussion of electrical pollution.

Thanks!
http://www.paul.senate.gov/?p=press_release&id=900

And lots of groups are on this one. Pretty much every major recreational trail association. Huge amounts of Democrat and Republican support.

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d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2013, 01:42:13 am »

MaineShark, have there been attempts to replicate his experiments? I'd love to know more about it.

Thanks for the link, Mercier. Checking it out...
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MaineShark

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #40 on: September 16, 2013, 07:10:04 am »

MaineShark, have there been attempts to replicate his experiments? I'd love to know more about it.

Yes.  Debunking that one is a standby in many colleges.

But if you want a reference that you can access easily, even Mythbusters took a shot at it.
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

Wolvenhaven

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #41 on: September 16, 2013, 05:07:27 pm »

People have all sorts of legitimate symptoms to "electrical allergies" but it's all psychosomatic.  Stick them in a faraday cage and tell them they've got a [imaginary] transmitter pointed at them and they freak out; stick them in a normal room and claim it's a faraday cage and they're fine.  It's nothing but hocus pocus science, snakeoil has a better reputation.
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d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #42 on: September 16, 2013, 07:27:37 pm »

Well, thanks, but I'd prefer something a little more substantial than Mythbusters. Since this is something you seem to know about, I was hoping for a link to an authoritative source...?

(I don't have the time to look up everything, you know; I already live in fear that Ixquick will cut me off one of these days... I use it like every 15 seconds... :P )

 --- topic change ---

My, I'm garnering quite the list of people who only post when they have something bad to say about other people's ideas. And never provide any proof of their opinion, neither documented facts nor a good chain of logic. Guess how much time I waste worrying about unproven opinions? (Beyond the ten seconds it took to type the last three sentences... yeesh, you guys are so predictable.  ::) )
« Last Edit: September 16, 2013, 07:32:09 pm by djsmith »
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MaineShark

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #43 on: September 16, 2013, 08:12:26 pm »

Well, thanks, but I'd prefer something a little more substantial than Mythbusters. Since this is something you seem to know about, I was hoping for a link to an authoritative source...?

Pick up a decent college textbook.  Not everything is linked on the Internet.

My, I'm garnering quite the list of people who only post when they have something bad to say about other people's ideas. And never provide any proof of their opinion, neither documented facts nor a good chain of logic. Guess how much time I waste worrying about unproven opinions?

You mean like the unproven opinions that there are such things as "electrical pollution" or "primary cell perception?"

Those are unproven opinions.  Have you or anyone else provided any evidence to support them?  No.  So who, precisely, is on your "list," eh?  Yourself?  "Sam Adams?"
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

d.j.smith

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Re: Electrical Pollution
« Reply #44 on: September 16, 2013, 08:41:53 pm »

Wow, that's a lot of hostility, there, Mr. Shark.

The only reply that I can give you is that I am a person who puts forth a LOT of effort to avoid holding incorrect ideas (to the extent that this is possible for a human being). I am skeptical of everything and constantly on guard against my own ego's tendency to bias. HOWEVER, as can be said of anyone, be it Einstein, Buddha, Jefferson, or Vos Savant, I have limits. When I run into them (always limits on time and energy, never on desire), I have to do what we all have to do at that point -- punt. That is what intuition is for. That is what common sense is for. That is what reputation is for (as in, the reputation my sources of information have with me, because I have and continue to periodically track their information back to primary sources, to see how honest they are being and how careful they are in their thinking).

A few days ago, on my own forum, I put up as the daily quote a phrase that had spontaneously occurred to me: "Always maintain a healthy skepticism -- of your own opinion."

Don't misunderstand the strength with which I'll defend my ideas. I remain willing to shed any idea -- my entire worldview, even -- at a moment's notice, if it is proven untrue. But the key word is proven. Would it make any sense, after putting so much effort and care into discerning the truth, to just drop everything I have learned as soon as someone tosses off a contrary opinion? No, sir, that would itself be an extreme form of gullibility.

I care about the Truth. Attacking that fact will not encourage pleasant discourse between us.

Anytime you want my sources, I'd be more than happy to share them. Eager, even. But it would help if you would inquire after them politely, rather than mid-sneer.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2013, 08:51:55 pm by djsmith »
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