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Author Topic: ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced  (Read 14252 times)

Mike Lorrey

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ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« on: July 27, 2003, 11:16:51 pm »

Well to be fair, WY does have a lot more land area.  According to the forestry service for the northeast, New Hampshire is 84% forest, with 4,824 thousand acres.

According to the stats for the interior west, Wyoming is 15.9% with 9.8 MM Acres.  This last inventory was 20 years ago though, so I don't know how it would be today.  NH's last inventory was 5 years ago.

But the IMPORTANT points from the reports:

Ninety three percent of New Hampshire's forest land, 4,508.6 thousand acres, is classified as timberland (formerly known as commercial forest land).
Eighty percent of New Hampshire's timberland is privately owned.

Wyoming has about 9.8 million acres of forest land, 9.1 million of it timberland. Over three-fourths is on public land, principally in Yellowstone and Grand Teton National Parks and seven National Forests.

As we've said, most Wyoming forests are federally owned, and they just ARE NOT SELLING.

Contrarily, NH forest land IS FOR SALE. In fact, MeadWestvaco, the largest timberland owner in NH, has put ALL of it's NH and Maine timberlands up for sale, about 650,000 acres. Now, much of that acrage is in Maine.

They want to sell it all in one lump sum. I've contacted the VP at MWV about this sale and they'd like to sell it all to one party.  Approximate deal value is about $50-60 million (my estimate). My thinking is that once the election happens and NH wins, we get the membership to form a corporation, pooling funds to buy this whole portfolio of property. Once bought, we sell of by parcel all the Maine holdings. Being sold as smaller parcels, we should generate more per acre for them, perhaps enough to entirely recoupe the initial investment.  Once the initial investment is paid back, the partners all divvy up the NH lands as profit and the corporation gets dissolved.

I call this The Galt's Gulch Project..... who wants in???

Anyone interested in forming this corporation, please email me. If NH wins the FSP election, we will form the Galt's Gulch Corporation, seeking to attract investment from FSP members, friends, and other supporters for the purposes of ensuring that there is enough affordable land in NH for the 20,000 FSP members to buy and live on when they move here.

Mike Lorrey
mlorrey@yahoo.com
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2003, 04:11:43 pm »

We have formed a Yahoogroup called galtsgulch to organize this project. Those interested should locate the galtsgulch group in Yahoogroups or email to:

galtsgulch-subscribe@yahoogroups.com

All interested parties should email me with name, mailing address, member number, and, optionally, a rough estimate of what amounts you might forsee investing in such a venture.

For more details, join the group and get caught up on the message traffic. We are taking nominations for the board of directors, resumes for corporate officers, and are actively seeking out angel investors among the membership.
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rdeacon

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2003, 12:37:35 am »

At a price of $50 million this would run approximately $2,500 per member if all of the first 20,000 members contributed.  We'd need to get some serious money on board in order for this to work out.  I'm not sure the economic makeup of FSP members, but we'd need some pretty rich people.

However, the math of this idea sounds pretty good otherwise.  The smaller parcels are sure to profit.  I could imagine a 125-150% ROI.
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #3 on: August 11, 2003, 12:00:50 am »

Quite so, Radar, if you keep it up I'll have to ban you from the discussion.

I have also put up a poll among existing members of the galts gulch list whether they want to keep it a NH project or look for similar opportunities elsewhere if another state is picked. So far, 77% of the members support exploring similar options in whatever state is picked.

I'm not too worried, though, considering that Governor Benson just signed on as a 'friend' and we (NH FSP proponents) just sent out a promo mailer to 20,000 Massachusetts libertarians, and nearly 1000 Connecticut Libertarians, that has shot FSP membership through the roof. I think our odds have gone way up.

To answer earlier questions, we plan on raising between $5-20 million from the members, which will be used to leverage financing for the whole purchase. If all goes according to plan, member investors will not only get their initial investment back in whole, but will profit by between 2-10 acres, on average.

Granted, it would all go very easily if we could recruit a few 'angel' investors to make large 'keystone' investments in the project that would give it the credibility to attract smaller investors. Once I get the business plan put together, we will see about seeking out such people.
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LeopardPM

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2003, 12:58:09 am »

very interested in the business plan Mike - it sounds good in theory (selling off the Maine portions to pay for the remaining, which I have done in the past, but, the property being sold has to have a market value large enough to do so - what research has been done along these lines?  If none, then its only a dream... the costs of rezoning or otherwise improving the property may overload the initial investors ability to cough up the require funds.  Plus, if the property takes 2-10 years to sell - thats a bunch of property taxes due.... hate that!


michael
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2003, 01:07:48 am »

Most all of the land is in unorganized areas, generally entire townships owned by the company and having nothing but logging roads and a few hunting camps in them. I know for a fact that hunters that already have cabin leases there would LOVE to buy large tracts around their cabins if they could.
There is no zoning in such areas.
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2003, 01:08:51 am »

Also, property taxes I have researched, and in these areas they are less than 1% annually.
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2003, 01:10:30 am »

Additionally, there is already a big market among the big city rich for what are nicknamed 'kingdoms' in northern Maine. Prices are high but not too high to desist the demand.
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LeopardPM

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2003, 01:11:40 am »

Entire townships? incorporated or chartered?  very interesting... what about infrastructure - you mentioned dirt roads - how about buildings, sewage, electricity, etc? can I find any info about the property or area on the web?

thanks for replying so quickly, Mike!

yours,
michael
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LeopardPM

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2003, 01:17:33 am »

Mike, why is my membership stil pending?  Nice picture on the Galts Gultch yahoo group BTW - is that lake included in the property?

n e e d   m o r e   i n f o   p l e a s e !

you struck my curious bone


michael
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2003, 08:47:32 am »

The picture is actually by my cousin, a geologist, who is studying climatology in New Zealand. This is a picture from one of his fishing trips there.
I didn't have any pictures handy from any of the properties, and I though this one really depicted the concept of the Gulch really well. I can dig up some from the actual properties if you like. I should probably do that anyways.
I just approved your membership. You didn't miss any new posts. I was a bit busy last night (and tired as well) after a busy week.
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #11 on: August 11, 2003, 09:03:11 am »

There are already some photos online from the unorganized township of Dix's Grant, in NH. Trevor Snyder's photo series containes a number of photos by Tony Stelik that he took on a trip with me to the Grant.

Dix's Grant is about 15,000 acres, rather small for a township, but it is all wilderness, with about 15 or so hunting cabins and probably about 40-50 miles of dirt/hardpack gravel roads.

Another entire township in NH is called Success. I've never been there myself, but I hear it is very similar to Dix's Grant. I think a photo trip is in the offing.
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #12 on: August 11, 2003, 09:10:24 am »

Entire townships? incorporated or chartered?  very interesting... what about infrastructure - you mentioned dirt roads - how about buildings, sewage, electricity, etc? can I find any info about the property or area on the web?

When I say unorganized, I mean that they are unicorporated townships with no residents, simply township sized sqares on the map that are entirely owned by the timber company. There are some hunting cabins. No sewage, no electricity, no nuthin. Roads covering areas useful to logging, bridges and culverts. You get your water from a stream or well, and you have leach fields for indoor toilets or you use an outhouse.

While there used to be whole logging camps back in the day (1930's), what remains are a few isolated cabins sold to hunters.

MeadWestVaco has not listed individual properties as of yet. Once we've organized as a corporation, I will approach them and seek further information about the entire portfolio. Until then, it would be unwise to contact them separately, as they only want to deal with someone who can buy their whole NH/Maine portfolio.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2003, 09:11:04 am by Mike Lorrey »
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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #13 on: August 11, 2003, 07:37:17 pm »

I would not contact anyone seperately... I am only interested in exactly what the project is considering buying
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Mike Lorrey

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Re:ATTN: Galt's Gulch Project Announced
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2003, 08:22:45 am »

Certainly. Before we can look at the goodies, we've got to come to the table as a real player. "Qualified buyers" is the term used, which means we have to be able to at least put up a front that we are capable of making the purchase before reviewing the property and entering into negotiations.
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