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Author Topic: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?  (Read 9588 times)

Bazil

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2011, 02:53:04 pm »

Well I don't know too much about getting to MIT using the bus, but I did use it to get to Logan.

Well the biotech company I work for buys stuff from a company in Nashua called Microscan.  There is also a solar panel company in Nashua, which Obama visited when he came to do that "town hall meeting" at one of the high school auditoriums. Of course BAE has a presence in Nashua, which is a defense contractor. Yeah and of course lots of software companies.
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antistate1190

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2011, 10:20:02 pm »


Some places in NH are havens for hi-tech like Nashua.  Lots of hi-tech companies there, lots of housing and not too bad commute to the Boston area.  There is even a Bus that goes down to Boston from Nashua.  Maybe that's the area to focus on attracting MIT people to.

The Nashua bus is state subsidized.  It still costs $5 each way.  That's currently more than gas to drive yourself in a Japanese sedan costs.  The bus drops you at South Station.  So, you have to buy two subway rides a day in addition to the bus fare (another $1.70 - really $3.40 but MIT pays 50% of T-Pass costs) to get to MIT.  So, $11.70 a day in commute costs (not counting driving yourself to the NH welcome area off RT3).  The total commute time would probably be about 2:30 each way (~21% of the day - ~28% of waking hours if you sleep 6 hrs) .

Don't even get me started on what a cluster f*ck disaster the MBTA is.  A drop of rain hits the ground or a flake of snow and they see huge delays if they're even able to run at all- not to mention what happens when some idiot loser too lazy to use a gun or a rope jumps in front of one of the trains and they have to "investigate" it.  The MBTA is largely unusable.  I rode the MBTA to work everyday for ~5 years.  It was painful.

What will the commute cost be if the state subsidy goes away?  As a FreeStater in NH, I'd really like to see the subsidy go away.

I don't know of any high tech companies in Nashua.  I know of a few software companies.  But, I wouldn't call them high tech- not by any stretch.  There are no VC funded techs founded by PhD's that I know of in Nashua.

Maybe someday, NH can start buying land from other states.  Like, parts of Maine and western Mass.  It can bring those areas under NH laws and make those areas more economically vibrant and give people that need to commute to Boston more convenient areas that are reasonable to live in.  My fingers are crossed.



Yes state-controlled transport is terrible. So why not demand the NH gov. get rid of all taxes on businesses so businesses will WANT to come to NH instead of Taxachusetts? Isn't there a small tech industry in Manchester-Bedford-Merrimack?
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antistate1190

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2011, 10:20:33 pm »

Opinion: MIT’s Libertarians
23 percent of students identify as libertarians

Doesn't surprise me that much.  Nerds and techy types definitely seem disproportionately libertarian.


They are smart enough to know that the gov. is inefficient.
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2011, 01:47:30 am »

Businesses actually don't evade NH because of the tax policy.
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antistate1190

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2011, 02:13:54 am »

Businesses actually don't evade NH because of the tax policy.

Then why do they? I've done research and I don't see many businesses in NH and I figured it was b/c of business taxes.
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2011, 04:14:08 am »

NH is full of businesses. I know of some that have left... and the reason why... but taxation wasn't a major reason.
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antistate1190

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2011, 04:19:32 am »

NH is full of businesses. I know of some that have left... and the reason why... but taxation wasn't a major reason.


So why doesn't NH have more large corporations? What are the reasons businesses left?
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2011, 05:01:51 am »

Large corporations tend to be very fluid...
Labor costs, energy costs, transportation costs, etc... all these play a criticial role in whether a business makes a profit to be taxed, or simply files a BET form.

But large corporations still exist in NH in all sectors. Its the small and midsize businesses with the problems.
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anon37268573

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2011, 11:57:26 pm »

NH is full of businesses. I know of some that have left... and the reason why... but taxation wasn't a major reason.


So why doesn't NH have more large corporations? What are the reasons businesses left?

Taxes are very high for businesses in NH.  I think that's the primary reason.

IIRC like 10 years ago, John Handcock wanted to open an office in NH and move a bunch of their employees out of downtown Boston.  They sent around a company wide notice asking who'd like to move to the new office.  But, to few people affirmatively responded to make it worthwhile for them.  So, the office never opened.

I think John Handcock's problem was the same the FSP's - people own houses and live near friends and family and their kids have friends at school, etc.  Moving to another state is a pretty big change.  The taxes and laws in Boston (and other places) are just not high enough to make it worthwhile for most people.

Big companies tend to stay where they start - like Walmart in Arkansas and Target in Minnesota.  So, if we want big companies in NH, I think the question is how can we help big companies start in NH.  Lower taxes would be one of the first steps.  The second would be somehow getting some young people to move to NH (or just stop leaving in droves after college).

Becoming a center of excellence for a certain specialized technology would also help.  Robotics might have a chance of being that technology with Dean Kamen near Manchester and one of the former iRobot execs running a start-up in Exter(?).  If you get many of the Robotics specialists in the working settled in NH, robotics companies will come to NH.  Humanoid robots that will replace many, if not most, minimum wage earners are not far off.  So, I expect that industry to just explode over the next 20 years.

But, do we really want a big company to locate here?  Big corporations tend to have unionized employees.  Imagine if GM or Ford built a large plant in NH.  I think a big part of what makes NH pro-liberty is low population density.  If the low population density goes, a lot of the liberty probably will go too.


       -anon

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antistate1190

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #24 on: January 20, 2011, 12:25:16 am »

NH is full of businesses. I know of some that have left... and the reason why... but taxation wasn't a major reason.


So why doesn't NH have more large corporations? What are the reasons businesses left?

Taxes are very high for businesses in NH.  I think that's the primary reason.

IIRC like 10 years ago, John Handcock wanted to open an office in NH and move a bunch of their employees out of downtown Boston.  They sent around a company wide notice asking who'd like to move to the new office.  But, to few people affirmatively responded to make it worthwhile for them.  So, the office never opened.

I think John Handcock's problem was the same the FSP's - people own houses and live near friends and family and their kids have friends at school, etc.  Moving to another state is a pretty big change.  The taxes and laws in Boston (and other places) are just not high enough to make it worthwhile for most people.

Big companies tend to stay where they start - like Walmart in Arkansas and Target in Minnesota.  So, if we want big companies in NH, I think the question is how can we help big companies start in NH.  Lower taxes would be one of the first steps.  The second would be somehow getting some young people to move to NH (or just stop leaving in droves after college).

Becoming a center of excellence for a certain specialized technology would also help.  Robotics might have a chance of being that technology with Dean Kamen near Manchester and one of the former iRobot execs running a start-up in Exter(?).  If you get many of the Robotics specialists in the working settled in NH, robotics companies will come to NH.  Humanoid robots that will replace many, if not most, minimum wage earners are not far off.  So, I expect that industry to just explode over the next 20 years.

But, do we really want a big company to locate here?  Big corporations tend to have unionized employees.  Imagine if GM or Ford built a large plant in NH.  I think a big part of what makes NH pro-liberty is low population density.  If the low population density goes, a lot of the liberty probably will go too.


       -anon



You make some good points. I wouldnt want union thugs in NH if I lived there. But technology companies tend not to have unions.
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2011, 12:11:19 pm »

The large manufacturing tech firms that moved from NH didn't have problems with taxation.
They flat out explained that they can not compete with other regions that had lower electrical costs to run machinery and equipment. And had trouble with lean inventory processes due to transportation issues.

The paper mill owners discovered they could import pulp from southeast Asia cheaper than they could purchase it locally.
But also soon realized that it had to come to a port and be loaded on a train... transported past other paper mills to be loaded on a truck and shipped into northern NH. They simply determined expanding the mills that where already along the train route and in regions with lower electrical costs made much more sense.

Having a heavy tax but being profitable, is much better than having low taxes but suffering losses.

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anon37268573

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2011, 04:04:50 pm »

The large manufacturing tech firms that moved from NH didn't have problems with taxation.
They flat out explained that they can not compete with other regions that had lower electrical costs to run machinery and equipment. And had trouble with lean inventory processes due to transportation issues.

Expensive electricity in NH is a problem.  NH lacks the natural resources to generate its own low cost electricity.  Getting the Northern Pass approved would be helpful.  Maybe someone that knows the FSP movers in the northern part of the state could get a letter writing campaign going.

Getting the nuclear power plants shut down and replaced with natural gas plants would also be helpful.

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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Lots of MIT students are libertarian?
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2011, 10:03:21 pm »

Personally, I wouldn't shut anything down.
HQ and PSNH can more than take care of themselves...
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