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Author Topic: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP  (Read 80002 times)

Dreepa

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #330 on: July 15, 2010, 12:01:32 pm »

Voting might be a potential tool up in NH for affecting change toward more liberty, but progress seems slow.

so move up and help.

actually lots of progress is being made on many fronts.

So things also take time to build.
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Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #331 on: July 15, 2010, 12:13:03 pm »

I am considering the move. But, I couldn't help in voting. I don't believe in the morality of voting when individual rights are at stake. It is not my right to sanction such crimes by participating. Also, it is against my moral code to accept any benefits from the government, and voting in their elections is a benefit, a privilege according to these scumbags. Thats why you have to ask permission by "registering." If/when I get there, I would perform CD, as I do wherever I am whenever the circumstances are appropriate. ;)
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"The essence of an individuals freedom is the opportunity to deviate from traditional ways of thinking and of doing things." ~Ludwig von Mises

John Edward Mercier

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #332 on: July 15, 2010, 12:25:35 pm »

I think the reason you register is so you don't vote as many times as you'd wish.
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Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #333 on: July 15, 2010, 12:35:35 pm »

@John, I don't believe that. They could check/record your identity when you voted without any registering. By definition, if you have to register, its a privilege not a right. Rights don't need pre-permission. It is, based on my research, a voluntary contract, though a fraudulent one, which waives a certain number of your Constitutional Rights in exchange for the "benefit" of voting in their elections. In particular, it waives your right not to appear for Jury duty when called. Thus the system enforces its unlawful perversion of the jury trial by pre-selecting those who buy into the system and excluding those who are most skeptical of all that government does. To waive your rights not to appear when called certainly waives a great number of inalienable rights, perhaps just about all of them. No thanks. :)

Hard to care about a system that does crap like this systematically and basically exists to nullify individual rights: http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-41752-Wilmington-Civil-Rights-Examiner~y2010m7d15-Libertarians-taken-off-the-ballot-in-Delaware-Major-parties-ensure-voters-may-not-elect-3rd-party
« Last Edit: July 15, 2010, 12:37:30 pm by Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux »
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"The essence of an individuals freedom is the opportunity to deviate from traditional ways of thinking and of doing things." ~Ludwig von Mises

Uncle Walt

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #334 on: July 15, 2010, 12:54:47 pm »

If voters weren't registered ... how would you make sure a person was eligible to vote?  EG; stop a candidate from bussing in supporters from outside the district?
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Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #335 on: July 15, 2010, 01:05:02 pm »

@Uncle Walt, it could be checked against the postal service address records, under penalty of fraud charges perhaps with a severe penalty. In fact, this is how it was done before the system of registrations and licensing (pledge slavery) was implemented in America. They used to simply check names against a central registry in the county library. As always, rules punishing the innocent ahead of the crime do not stop the crime but rather carry only unintended consequences. Of course, under the more limited minarchy intended by a portion of the "Founders", voting would be of little real consequence to the majority of the people and there would be little advantage to bussing them in. Indeed, once upon a time in America, very few people bothered voting since there was no one to be victimized by doing so and no one able to victimize you by doing so.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2010, 01:08:30 pm by Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux »
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"The essence of an individuals freedom is the opportunity to deviate from traditional ways of thinking and of doing things." ~Ludwig von Mises

time4liberty

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #336 on: July 15, 2010, 05:51:20 pm »

Personally, I choose to register, not the least of reasons being that I very much want to be called for jury duty. It's a cost/benefit analysis, as far as I'm concerned. Is the small amount of added aggression you risk by registering worth the small amount of power it gives you, to throw a monkey wrench in the abuse? I say yes.
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Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #337 on: July 15, 2010, 08:54:56 pm »

@ttie,

I respect that choice. I am the local coordinator for FIJA (Florida Informed Jury Association) here in Tampa/Pinellas. We stand outside the courtrooms and hand out jury nullification information. Still, I can't personally sanction voting given the situation. But for those that do, I hope they will serve on juries and nullify victimless "crimes" as it is indeed the only real benefit from voting and its a pretty big one.
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"The essence of an individuals freedom is the opportunity to deviate from traditional ways of thinking and of doing things." ~Ludwig von Mises

Ed

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #339 on: July 15, 2010, 11:03:37 pm »

dude, don't bother him with facts

he needs to rag on people for not being PURE libertarians
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #340 on: July 16, 2010, 12:29:55 am »

@John, I don't believe that. They could check/record your identity when you voted without any registering. By definition, if you have to register, its a privilege not a right. Rights don't need pre-permission. It is, based on my research, a voluntary contract, though a fraudulent one, which waives a certain number of your Constitutional Rights in exchange for the "benefit" of voting in their elections. In particular, it waives your right not to appear for Jury duty when called. Thus the system enforces its unlawful perversion of the jury trial by pre-selecting those who buy into the system and excluding those who are most skeptical of all that government does. To waive your rights not to appear when called certainly waives a great number of inalienable rights, perhaps just about all of them. No thanks. :)

Hard to care about a system that does crap like this systematically and basically exists to nullify individual rights: http://www.examiner.com/examiner/x-41752-Wilmington-Civil-Rights-Examiner~y2010m7d15-Libertarians-taken-off-the-ballot-in-Delaware-Major-parties-ensure-voters-may-not-elect-3rd-party
They do. NH has same-day registration... that's the check of your identity and eligibility to vote.
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Sovereign Laissez-faire LeRoux

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #341 on: July 16, 2010, 07:14:14 am »

Same day registration indeed indicates there is no need for pre-registration. They do not need a contract binding you to waive your rights, if they can simply check your identity at the door, use that list to prevent repeat voters, and check that list against the postal addresses to confirm eligibility. They want you in that contract, so they can keep the 'court' business (tax collections) going, so they can keep that cash register cha-chinging.
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"The essence of an individuals freedom is the opportunity to deviate from traditional ways of thinking and of doing things." ~Ludwig von Mises

John Edward Mercier

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #342 on: July 16, 2010, 03:46:33 pm »

Those 'checks' of identity and residence is what registration is about.
I don't know what 'tax collection' your talking about.
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Dreepa

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #343 on: July 16, 2010, 05:05:58 pm »

love how far this thread as gone off topic.
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10stateswithnh

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Re: PorcFest 2010 raises reservations about joining the FSP
« Reply #344 on: July 16, 2010, 05:23:50 pm »

I actually enjoy reading it more now that it has gone off-topic.  :D

I only read it to stay up to date with it and see if I can help alleviate some people's concerns.

Personally, I find the idea that people would judge the whole movement by one event, or online postings only, and then spend a lot of time talking about how afraid they are that the stuff they want to happen won't happen, or that the movement is being taken over by a certain group (there isn't really much to take over in such a decentralized movement), to me that is a huge waste of time and potentially turns off people who would in fact love living in NH, just as I loved visiting there for 6 days and didn't want to get on the plane back.
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Bryce in Rochester
States I have lived in:
PA, DE, WA, ME, SC, NY, GA, UT, CO, NH as of Sep 2011!
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