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Author Topic: A slight change to the FAQ?  (Read 5970 times)

Reaper

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A slight change to the FAQ?
« on: August 08, 2002, 09:49:28 pm »

The following is directly from the FAQ on the FSP web site:

"7Q. Why don't we make common cause with white separatists?


7A. The Free State Project unequivocally condemns racism and all other forms of bigotry. Although we do not support a government ban on racial discrimination by private individuals, and we do not attempt to divine our members' private thoughts, we will exercise our right as a private organization to expel anyone who undertakes racial agitation. "


Could we possibly expand this just a little?  I'd like to see a little more detail as opposed to just "condemns racism and all other forms of bigotry".

I'm thinking we're going to get a lot of folks coming here whose idea of freedom involves removing citizens or even human rights from all those damned <insert racial slur>s, <insert religious slur>s, <insert ethnic slur>s and also those damned <insert sexual slur>s too.

Obviously these people have a right to thier opinions, to express those opinions and (at least in my opinion) to act on those opinions with regard to their own person and property.  However, if we are seeking a truly free state it seems the cost of admission is recognizing the equal rights of all those damned <insert racial slur>s, <insert religious slur>s, <insert ethnic slur>s and also those damned <insert sexual slur>s too.

Does the FSP even want to sign up bigots of any flavor?  

I'd think we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot.
« Last Edit: August 08, 2002, 09:51:07 pm by Reaper »
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Reaper
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Matthew

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #1 on: August 08, 2002, 10:08:14 pm »

I don't mind bigots signing up, as long as there bigotry is just mental not political, if you know what I mean ???
Cause then poeple could start saying no gays, or blacks, or feminists, etc.
As long as the are with in the groups political realm and theory I think they should be allowed.
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Reaper

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2002, 11:11:34 pm »

Perhaps I wasn't clear.

I couldn't care less what they think, say or who they refuse to serve at their business/rent their land to etc., etc.  

I'm talking about people who want to expel citizens or remove the equal rights of citizens based on race, gender, religion, ethnicity or sexual orientation.
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Reaper
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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2002, 11:21:18 pm »

Oh, I see.  I personally think they have no place here.  Thats like allowing socialists, facists, populists, etc.  It defeats the purpose.
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Elizabeth

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2002, 12:11:51 am »

This FAQ was carefully considered.  

It is a direct response to a particular issue, that being that certain other separatist movements are racial in nature, and we wanted to make it clear we were not associated with them.

However, we are not the thought police, and will not get involved in arbitrating name-calling, no matter how foolish.

We hashed this out at length, considering whether or not to even include it, because we do not want to be mis-perceived as politically correct.  But it is not about name calling, it is about racially-based political movements.
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Dex Sinister

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2002, 02:52:30 am »


This FAQ was carefully considered.  

It is a direct response to a particular issue, that being that certain other separatist movements are racial in nature, and we wanted to make it clear we were not associated with them.


Sorry, I’m confused: You are attempting to define us as a non-radical separatist movement here, yes?

Quote

However, we are not the thought police, and will not get involved in arbitrating name-calling, no matter how foolish.

We hashed this out at length, considering whether or not to even include it, because we do not want to be mis-perceived as politically correct.  But it is not about name calling, it is about racially-based political movements.


Logically, the problem lies with “unequivocally [unmistakably] condemning racism and all other forms of bigotry,” and then saying that only racism is actionable. Logically, hating or not wanting to live near blacks is no more obnoxious than hating or not wanting to live near Jews, and to act on one while ignoring the other is morally inconsistent.

If “all other forms of bigotry,” is merely inserted there are a flimsy cover to insincerely make the statement sound more universal, then it should be removed to reveal the actual intent.

In any case, white separatists are not white supremacists – separatists are Christian bigots who don’t want to live near black people, and generally move to remote places to accomplish such.  I’d like to know how this is any different than catering to Christian bigots who don’t want to live near homosexuals, atheists, Jews or Wiccans - or any other sort of bigots for that matter.

OTOH, supremacists agitate against blacks, Jews, and just about everyone else who is not white and Protestant, rendering any treatment of them as exclusively “racist” as completely silly.

IMO, the statement should read:
“The Free State Project unequivocally condemns racism and all other forms of bigotry as irrational. Although We do not , however support a government bans on racial discrimination bigotry by private individuals. We recognize that some people will always prefer not to live near people who are not exactly like themselves, and recognize their right to do this as a form of freedom of association. and We do not attempt to divine our members' private thoughts, nor control their associations. We welcome anyone, regardless of their likes and dislikes, as long as they are willing to grant that all members of society have an equal right to freedom. We will exercise our right as a private organization to expel anyone who undertakes racial agitation. cannot or will not work to that end. "

Dex }:>=-
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Reaper

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2002, 09:07:52 am »

That's very well put Dex.

You made my point better than I did.
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Eddie_Bradford

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2002, 09:35:23 am »

Quote
Quote
[quote/]
[quote/]

Quote from: Elizabeth on Today at  12:11:51am    
This FAQ was carefully considered.  

It is a direct response to a particular issue, that being that certain other separatist movements are racial in nature, and we wanted to make it clear we were not associated with them.


Sorry, I&#8217;m confused: You are attempting to define us as a non-radical separatist movement here, yes?



Hey Dex I think you Dyslexiad the word racial for radical and that's why you were confused.
But I don't know if our movenment is Radical or reactionary.  Theoretically going back to the early days of the Constitution is by and large what we want to do in this case we would be reactionary, but if we scale back government even more then this would be something totally new so it might be radical I don't know anymore my brain has turned to mush since I started working.
-Eddie  
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Dex Sinister

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Re:A slight change to the FAQ?
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2002, 04:54:57 am »


Hey Dex I think you Dyslexiad the word racial for radical and that's why you were confused.
But I don't know if our movenment is Radical or reactionary.  Theoretically going back to the early days of the Constitution is by and large what we want to do in this case we would be reactionary, but if we scale back government even more then this would be something totally new so it might be radical I don't know anymore my brain has turned to mush since I started working.


I'm sorry Eddie - I quite honestly have no conception of what you are trying to communicate here.  :-\

Dex }:>=-
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