Free State Project Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4   Go Down

Author Topic: True History  (Read 16360 times)

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #30 on: February 11, 2010, 09:43:16 pm »

The only voluntary part of the program is getting an SS number or receiving benefits.
You have to apply for either of those.
Logged

xAlpha

  • First 1000
  • FSP Participant
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 118
  • Free State Project IT Liaison
    • Rifle Fire
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #31 on: February 14, 2010, 11:57:48 am »

How can someone hate banks, but love Hamilton and see him as a patriot?
Logged

greap

  • First 1000
  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1009
  • What we have here is a failure to communicate
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #32 on: February 14, 2010, 05:16:36 pm »

Another coincidence was that he was in Dallas, working for Pepsi Co, on the day JFK was assassinated. He said he heard the news as he was leaving on a bus, I think, when some woman said the president's been shot.

Coincidence != Conspiracy. I was a the train just behind one that got bombed on 7/7 in London, being a fanatical anti-government person does that mean that I am part of some overarching conspiracy? If not then why does Nixon being a fanatical establishment person in the same city when JFK was shot equate to a conspiracy?

I stopped believing in most conspiracies during most of the 80s and 90s I think. But in 97 I read Len Horowitz's book, Emerging Viruses: AIDS & Ebola, which showed that such viruses were likely biowarfare weapons created in the lab by Gallo et al for population control.

Ebola was first identified in 1976. Haemorrhagic fevers have been recorded for as long as written history has existed, it is likely Ebola existed long before 1976 but was misidentified as Yellow Fever or something similar.

AIDS is believed to have originated as a mutation of SIV (a similar virus in primates) sometime in the late 19th or early 20th centuries (well before the ability to tailor a virus existed). Also given it originated in Central/West Africa where uncooked money brain eaten directly out of the skull is a typical snack the transmission vector from primates to humans is pretty clear.

Also both would be of limited value for bio-warfare, they are not airborne and don't have a known cure.

I am not sure if you have ever travelled in that part of the world but if you have then you would understand why it was remarkable that they even identified Ebola in 76. The former Zaire has no infrastructure to mention outside of 4 or 5 towns. In the jungle villages can go months without outside contact, and that contact is typically via river boat, there are children who have never seen a white person and generally it is one of the most undeveloped regions in the world.

in which I think he mentioned the need to explore Mars and the solar system.

O/T but no such need exists, only a desire. It would be awesome if they did purely from the geek perspective but there is certainly no need to, human population will be peaking somewhere around 8-10 billion which we have sufficient resources to maintain (it will likely decline to half its current number before stabilising too). If we ever colonise the wider galaxy it will be by machine incubated foetuses due to the journey length and resource needs for a live crew. The colony would have no contact with earth, communication with a round trip in to centuries renders any sort of social integration impossible and people wouldn't travel back and forth between for the same reasons for machine propagation.

We might colonise near earth space for good reason, maybe even as far out as the Kuiper belt for access to certain resources, but there is simply no reason for going beyond that.

and that he used the excuse of thrift to strip the army and navy of funds

The framers wrote at length about the dangers of a standing army, it was kept small for precisely that reason. Localised defence was considered to be the responsibility of the individual states militias not the central government.

In the case of the navy it was formed for the express purpose of protecting merchant ships from piracy not to wage war, the size was right based on what they needed to do and they stomped the British in the war of 1812 anyway.
Logged
_____________________________________________________________

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #33 on: February 14, 2010, 05:42:39 pm »

How can someone hate banks, but love Hamilton and see him as a patriot?
His overwhelming support for the Gold Standard. Even though the Colonies had just fought a war to gain freedom from it, and would soon see a rebellion.
Logged

xAlpha

  • First 1000
  • FSP Participant
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 118
  • Free State Project IT Liaison
    • Rifle Fire
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2010, 11:03:39 am »

How can someone hate banks, but love Hamilton and see him as a patriot?
His overwhelming support for the Gold Standard. Even though the Colonies had just fought a war to gain freedom from it, and would soon see a rebellion.

And a huge supporter of national banks and protective tariffs.
Logged

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #35 on: February 16, 2010, 11:20:06 am »

How can someone hate banks, but love Hamilton and see him as a patriot?
His overwhelming support for the Gold Standard. Even though the Colonies had just fought a war to gain freedom from it, and would soon see a rebellion.

And a huge supporter of national banks and protective tariffs.
If they 'hate' banks, especially national ones, why would this win him their support?
« Last Edit: February 16, 2010, 01:53:46 pm by John Edward Mercier »
Logged

xAlpha

  • First 1000
  • FSP Participant
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 118
  • Free State Project IT Liaison
    • Rifle Fire
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2010, 03:07:26 pm »

Well,t hat's exactly what I'm asking. How is Hamilton a patriot, and not a villain, if he espoused a national bank and protective tariffs?
Logged

Luck

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2957
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2010, 03:48:04 pm »

Anyone who has different ideas from yours is a villain or traitor?
Logged

rossby

  • Director of Development
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4801
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2010, 05:35:47 pm »

Anyone who has different ideas from yours is a villain or traitor?

I think anyone conspiring to threaten the civil American government with its own military forces to pressure the several states into ceding more sovereignty to the general government so that certain privileged individuals might make a great deal of money in international trade is quite appropriately labeled a "villain" and "traitor".
Logged

Luck

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2957
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2010, 06:09:27 pm »

What if his actions, whatever they really were, esp. re the national bank and protectionism, were not for private gain, but for keeping the U.S. secure from future reconquest by Britain, or any other aggressor?

http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=10192
http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=11196
« Last Edit: February 17, 2010, 09:43:35 pm by Luck »
Logged

Luck

  • FSP Participant
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2957
England Falsified Gold Data
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2010, 06:10:53 pm »

Different Topic:

Bank of England falsified gold data to rig interest rates from 1925-31
Submitted by cpowell on Sun, 2010-02-14 07:00. Section: Documentation

1:53a ET Sunday, February 14, 2010

Dear Friend of GATA and gold:

Zero Hedge's pseudonymous Tyler Durden, less well known as Dan Ivandjiiski, yesterday disclosed a scholarly paper written by University of Tennessee economics professor John R. Garrett and published by the Journal of Economic History in September 1995 describing the Bank of England's falsification of gold holdings data, undertaken with the help of the U.S. Federal Reserve, to deceive the markets and manipulate interest rates secretly between 1925 and 1931.

Of course the ends of this deception and manipulation of gold data are the same that GATA long has been asserting for the contemporary gold price suppression scheme. The falsification of gold holdings data by the Bank of England as reported by Professor Garrett is mirrored perfectly by the data-falsification and market-manipulation scheme described in the April 1961 memorandum kept in the archive of former Fed Chairman William McChesney Martin, about which GATA consultant James Turk wrote at length in January 2009:

http://www.gata.org/node/7096

Durden/Ivandjiiski asks:

"Why did the Bank of England openly and flagrantly manipulate critical data? Why did it mislead the citizens of the country it was supposed to serve? And if this happened in the past, is it happening now? Is this the reason why the Federal Reserve is so opposed to exposing itself to public scrutiny and audits? If the Bank of England was engaging in outright fraud in the 1925-1931 period, why would today be any different?"

Durden/Ivandjiiski concludes:

"If after reading this historical evidence of central banking treason, senators are unable to pass Ron Paul's Fed transparency act, then there has to be open social action to clean out the Senate of all those who claim that the Fed's actions are pure and true, as they are merely corrupt cronies, bought entirely by interests of the Federal Reserve, and thus Wall Street."

So once again it has been established that deception and secret market manipulation are primary tools of central banking, particularly in regard to gold, and that it is all just a matter of long history and public record -- albeit history and public record that cannot be discussed in polite company, or at least not in the mainstream financial news media.

You can find Durden/Ivanjiiski's commentary, headlined "Exclusive: The Bank Of England Engaged In Flagrant Gold Manipulation in the Interwar Period via the New York Fed; Does History Repeat Itself?," along with Professor Garrett's study, at the Zero Hedge Internet site here:

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/exclusive-bank-england-engaged-flagrant...

Garrett's study is also posted at GATA's Internet site here:

http://www.gata.org/files/Garrett-BankOfEnglandGoldLies.pdf
Logged

Uncle Walt

  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 291
Re: True History
« Reply #41 on: February 18, 2010, 10:39:15 am »

I would debate Lincoln as a patriot. 

He blatantly violated the 10th Amendment by waging war against states trying to secceed from the United States, as was their Right.  Unless you can show me where the Constitution says (basically), "Once you join us, you can't change your mind"?  Seems to me, since courts have declared we have a "freedom of association" ... it naturally follows that The People of a state can also choose NOT to associate as members of a group with other states.  Lincoln himself admitted the war was to "preserve the Union".  Kind of like the mafia, eh?  Once you're in, there's only one way out - death.

He also violated the 1st Amendment, due to his actions against newspapers who objected to "Lincoln's War". 

It also seems to me, that an involuntary draft is a violation ... in spirit, if not by the letter of the law ... of the 3rd, 4th, and 5th Amendments. 

Not to mention the irony of the government enslaving men from the northern states, in the name of waging war against Free/Sovereign Peoples ... in order to free their slaves, by putting their lands under rule you impose.  In effect, enslaving the free People, to free the enslaved.
Logged

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #42 on: February 18, 2010, 05:07:44 pm »

Well,t hat's exactly what I'm asking. How is Hamilton a patriot, and not a villain, if he espoused a national bank and protective tariffs?
They asked why would someone still deem a patriot...
Because they believe in a gold standard as he did. Once someone finds a principle area of agreement they tend to rationalize.
The gold standard entered the US through the chartering of that national bank and tariff system.
Logged

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History [Now Re Civil War]
« Reply #43 on: February 18, 2010, 05:12:00 pm »

Anyone who has different ideas from yours is a villain or traitor?

I think anyone conspiring to threaten the civil American government with its own military forces to pressure the several states into ceding more sovereignty to the general government so that certain privileged individuals might make a great deal of money in international trade is quite appropriately labeled a "villain" and "traitor".
Pretty much covers all the members of the CC that worked on the US Constitution.
Logged

John Edward Mercier

  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 6534
  • Native
Re: True History
« Reply #44 on: February 18, 2010, 05:18:22 pm »

The Civil War issue has many variants... including which side agressed first.

But on the BoE falsification of gold holdings...
This is why the Gold Standard could not stand. Its doubtful that the FED is worried about an audit; its been law since 1978.
The FED is worried about independence in the rate setting functions... which if allowed to become political would have pretty devastating effects on the economy and middle class Americans; i.e. Freddy and Fannie.


Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3] 4   Go Up