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Author Topic: Considering  (Read 3286 times)

Ventrek

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Considering
« on: October 14, 2008, 10:57:05 pm »

I'm considering this move. 

I first heard that libertarians were moving to New Hampshire about two years ago.  I came across the FSP website while I was searching for information on porcupines.

I would have expected to see this project attracting violent revolutionaries and single issue dogmatists.  That would kill the project very quickly.  The Feds would be on you and the people of New Hampshire, being hard working folk who want to live in peace, would probably run you out.

What I'm seeing are people like me, who want to reverse the trend of eroding personal freedom thru peaceful means.  It's what I've been looking for, for twenty years.

With the way things have been going for the last few years, I think this may be the last opportunity that people will have to make a change thru peaceful actions.  The lesson of history is that when revolution comes, it doesn't matter who wins, tyranny is the result.  So I feel compelled to come and help make a difference.

I am self employed.  I remodel kitchens and bathrooms.  I do all the work myself, all the plumbing, electrical, mechanical, tile, paint, and finish carpentry.  In order to move, I'll have to be able to set myself up in business there and I'll have to save enough money to float until the work starts coming in.  I'm hoping that FSP members will be a network to help make that happen.

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Michael J Shaffer

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Re: Considering
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2008, 11:32:38 pm »

Ventrek....

 Welcome!! :)

  Michael
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Michael J Shaffer

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Re: Considering
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2008, 12:00:20 am »

Ventrek...
 I've been thinking about you moving and your line of work. You know We have FSPers in Real Estate and various property ownerships in NH. I would scout the various boards on the Forum relating to housing and and talk to some of these folks. Since it is to the advantage of all of us to develop this "internal economy": FSPers working with and for other FSPers, I think your skill set would be a good fit. Ref:ridleyreport.com/video/2008/oct/nh_free_stater_economy_provides_work_troubled_times

  Michael
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maxxoccupancy

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Re: Considering
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2008, 12:55:20 am »

porcmanor.com
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Ventrek

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Re: Considering
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2008, 01:18:11 am »

There's a lot to be said for being part of a community with a common goal, especially a community that pays in hard currency.

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling.  There's the case of the Browns and I'd like to know what really did happen there.  Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession.  Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.
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J’raxis 270145

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Re: Considering
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2008, 01:27:21 am »

Welcome! ;D
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Porcupine The Godful Heathen

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Re: Considering
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2008, 08:57:42 am »

There's a lot to be said for being part of a community with a common goal, especially a community that pays in hard currency.

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling. There's the case of the Browns and I'd like to know what really did happen there. Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession. Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.

Welcome Ventrek. As for secession the kind of secession any Porcupine's are interested in is a different approach than the CSA tried. A peaceful one. The Browns decided that they wanted to keep their money and didn't want to go to prison over it so they holed themselves up and lots of Porcs went to support them along with others and eventually they got infilitrated by a Fed mole and got arrested.
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margomaps

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Re: Considering
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2008, 09:49:23 am »

There's a lot to be said for being part of a community with a common goal, especially a community that pays in hard currency.

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling. There's the case of the Browns and I'd like to know what really did happen there. Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession. Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.

Welcome Ventrek. As for secession the kind of secession any Porcupine's are interested in is a different approach than the CSA tried. A peaceful one. The Browns decided that they wanted to keep their money and didn't want to go to prison over it so they holed themselves up and lots of Porcs went to support them along with others and eventually they got infilitrated by a Fed mole and got arrested.

I would only add that "lots of porcs" is a relative term.  There are almost 8,000 signed up for the FSP, and probably more than 600 in the state.  A small percentage of even those 600 may have supported the Browns, and I'd guess that none of them supported any kind of violent confrontation with the government.  What sympathy there was for the Browns likely extended only as far as "income tax is not the way to go, and good for the Browns for having the courage to risk prison by standing up for their convictions."
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Porcupine The Godful Heathen

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Re: Considering
« Reply #8 on: October 15, 2008, 09:52:36 am »

What sympathy there was for the Browns likely extended only as far as "income tax is not the way to go, and good for the Browns for having the courage to risk prison by standing up for their convictions."

That's right.
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freedomroad

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Re: Considering
« Reply #9 on: October 15, 2008, 10:05:07 am »

Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.

Oh nice and welcome to the forum.  I grew up close to Shiloh, also.

Anyway, you cannot really avoid attracting people who like the idea of separating from the federal government.  There was a poll done recently and I think it suggested that tens of millions of Americans support the idea.  It makes sense that some of those people would also like to shrink the size of government and have more freedom so much that they would move to NH and work towards those causes. 
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Fishercat

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Re: Considering
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2008, 10:41:36 am »

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling.  [...] Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession.

The opposite is also true.   That is, there are forums where FSP members are vocally in opposition to pushing for secession.

FSP participants have a wide range of interpretations of what the pledge means and how best to achieve it.  You should not assume that a vocal subset of those participants reflect the tenure of the project as a whole - especially if you are looking at linked forums, which will tend to emphasize certain interpretations over others. 

And when you are in New Hampshire, actively involved, I think you will find that it is easy to find many like-minded people to associate with. 
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maxxoccupancy

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Re: Considering
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2008, 01:03:19 pm »

If you're an advocate of less government and more freedom, I would say make the move, sign up on this site and sign the Next 1,000 pledge.  There are lots of people who are doing lots of different things here, and there are more ways than I can count to promote liberty.
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"The Free State Project is an agreement among 20,000 pro-liberty activists to move to New Hampshire, where they will exert the fullest practical effort toward the creation of a society in which the maximum role of government is the protection of life, liberty, and property."

anon37268573

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Re: Considering
« Reply #12 on: October 15, 2008, 02:31:15 pm »

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling.  There's the case of the Browns and I'd like to know what really did happen there.  Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession.  Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.

You could also just move to New Hampshire and not join the FSP, or sign any pledges.  A large number of libertarians have done just that.

Massachusetts is fighting tooth and nail against a tax cut on the ballot while businesses flee the state.  The Mass. government just laid off 1,000 state workers due to a $1.2B USD projected budget deficit this year.  An Alabama county is on the brink of bankruptcy.  A California city had to declare bankruptcy over pension and benefit promises for police and fire employees.  All three of those states are begging for sweet heart loans from the Federal Government while some banks fail and other banks with friends in Washington rake in billions in unearned profits.  It looks just like the first stages of the collapse in _Atlas_Shrugged_ around the US right now.  Luckily for all of us (or perhaps unluckily),  New Hampshire isn't hidden in a mountain valley and you don't have to accept any creed to enter it.

Come to NH!  If I ever need your services, I'll happily compensate you in Gold and/or Silver coins. =)
« Last Edit: October 15, 2008, 02:34:25 pm by anon37268573 »
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maxxoccupancy

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Re: Considering
« Reply #13 on: October 15, 2008, 03:40:04 pm »

+1

Move, work actively towards less government and more freedom, then sign only if you agree.  Techinically, the Next 1,000 pledge doesn't require that you join the FSP, just that you will become a liberty activist, here.
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sj

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Re: Considering
« Reply #14 on: October 15, 2008, 09:41:33 pm »

There's a lot to be said for being part of a community with a common goal, especially a community that pays in hard currency.

As I research the FSP more, I am coming across some things that are troubling. There's the case of the Browns and I'd like to know what really did happen there. Then there are forums linked to this one that seem to harbor a lot of people who are pushing for secession. Having grown up close to Shiloh battlefield, I have a lot to say on the practicality of that move.

Welcome Ventrek. As for secession the kind of secession any Porcupine's are interested in is a different approach than the CSA tried. A peaceful one. The Browns decided that they wanted to keep their money and didn't want to go to prison over it so they holed themselves up and lots of Porcs went to support them along with others and eventually they got infilitrated by a Fed mole and got arrested.

I would only add that "lots of porcs" is a relative term.  There are almost 8,000 signed up for the FSP, and probably more than 600 in the state.  A small percentage of even those 600 may have supported the Browns, and I'd guess that none of them supported any kind of violent confrontation with the government.  What sympathy there was for the Browns likely extended only as far as "income tax is not the way to go, and good for the Browns for having the courage to risk prison by standing up for their convictions."

And much of that sympathy evaporated once it became clear how nutty Ed Brown really is.
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