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[Avtodidakt]

Since finding out about this project, I've been juggling with the idea of running off to New Hampshire, either this fall, or two years from now, after earning my Associate's - assuming I do decide to go to college at all. Are there any groups that have come together to share expenses in multi-bedroom apartments, farmhouses, etc?

[Ron Helwig]

Porc Manor lists the primary known porcupine landlords.

[FTL_Ian]

College is a scam. 

Some people in Keene are looking for a roommate:
http://nhunderground.com/forum/index.php?topic=12754.msg234553#msg234553

http://move.freekeene.com

[Keyser Soce]

College is a scam. 

Agreed.

Results clearly show that the path of paying for a college education is clearly not worth the cost. The higher earnings later do not compensate for the money spent on tuition early on.

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:7qDXhhvzHnoJ:homepages.udayton.edu/~jenninal/aj5_Module7_PV.doc+college+degree+worthwhile+beneficial&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=firefox-a

According to the Forbes list of the 400 wealthiest Americans, 4 out of the top 5 are college dropouts

http://willblogforfood.typepad.com/will_blog_for_food/2005/12/you_hear_all_th.html

[sj]

College is a scam. 

Agreed.

Results clearly show that the path of paying for a college education is clearly not worth the cost. The higher earnings later do not compensate for the money spent on tuition early on.

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:7qDXhhvzHnoJ:homepages.udayton.edu/~jenninal/aj5_Module7_PV.doc+college+degree+worthwhile+beneficial&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=firefox-a

According to the Forbes list of the 400 wealthiest Americans, 4 out of the top 5 are college dropouts

http://willblogforfood.typepad.com/will_blog_for_food/2005/12/you_hear_all_th.html

Most people aren't going to be the "richest people in America" so that doesn't apply to most of us.  I also question the earnings versus tuition based on the fact that many people go to college and study completely unmarketable subjects like literature, sociology or <fill in the blank> studies.  I imagine such people bring the average return down further than it would be for people who study business, math, science, engineering, etc.

Just doing the math, if you go to community college for two years ($3K for 4 semesters = $12K) and a state university for 2 ($6K for 4 semesters = $24K), you've spent $36K on college.  Not counting inflation, if you earn just $3600 more per year based on your degree, it will pay itself back in 10 years.  If I was interested enough, we could calculate the amount extra you'd have to earn if you include inflation, but it wouldn't change the calculation much.

[Avtodidakt]

Aye, that's an internal (and external, as it seems to be the greatest source of peer pressure for me) conflict I've been bouncing back and forth with for a long time now. I certainly don't disagree that the necessity of going to college has been overblown - one might go so far as to say that it's simply a tool for social engineering - and it's comforting to know that there are plenty of adults out there who understand this. However, I have some rather...lofty goals in mind for the future, specifically getting into politics and working my way up as far as possible (congress is the golden goose egg), using psychology/sociology as a reform platform.

Granted, if I were more inwardly focused, I'd make a beeline for some sort of tradeskill and avoid the temptation to enter into a university, but in lieu of the political climate I feel a certain responsibility to take the aforementioned path. I just don't see how I could possibly accomplish that without a degree. Plus, the community college I would be attending has a work-study program that covers the majority of the tuition. Of course, if anyone can point me in the right direction, please do, because I really would like to side-step college.

[Keyser Soce]

College is a scam. 

Agreed.

Results clearly show that the path of paying for a college education is clearly not worth the cost. The higher earnings later do not compensate for the money spent on tuition early on.

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:7qDXhhvzHnoJ:homepages.udayton.edu/~jenninal/aj5_Module7_PV.doc+college+degree+worthwhile+beneficial&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=firefox-a

According to the Forbes list of the 400 wealthiest Americans, 4 out of the top 5 are college dropouts

http://willblogforfood.typepad.com/will_blog_for_food/2005/12/you_hear_all_th.html

Just doing the math, if you go to community college for two years ($3K for 4 semesters = $12K) and a state university for 2 ($6K for 4 semesters = $24K), you've spent $36K on college.  Not counting inflation, if you earn just $3600 more per year based on your degree, it will pay itself back in 10 years.  If I was interested enough, we could calculate the amount extra you'd have to earn if you include inflation, but it wouldn't change the calculation much.

I have seen the statistics before from a different source and it's much worse than you make it out to be. 36k is very low to begin with and where is the cost of books and other supplies? Most students go further into debt during that time and then there's interest on that debt. Most importantly, they've missed 4 years in the workplace so not only do you have to count all they spent for 4 years but all they didn't earn for 4 years.

I'll try to find the more detailed stats but if I remember correctly, everything taken into account, women and minorities with a 4 year degree over their lifetimes made maybe 6% - 8% more. And that's certainly no guarantee, not that there are any.

If your goal is to be upper middle class, college is probably a good idea. If your goal is to be rich, it's likely a waste of time. If your goal is to learn and educate yourself, there are better and cheaper ways. If your goal is to be free, you most definitely don't want to spend your life working for someone else in which case a degree is almost worthless IMO.

I know lots of small and medium size business owners. The people with degrees work for them.

[TEBON]

maybe you could consider the Seacoast, a little town called FREEBROOK hehe Seabrook rather.

[Avtodidakt]

Care to elaborate? I'd assume the coast would be outrageously expensive to live on

[FTL_Ian]

Just doing the math, if you go to community college for two years ($3K for 4 semesters = $12K) and a state university for 2 ($6K for 4 semesters = $24K), you've spent $36K on college.  Not counting inflation, if you earn just $3600 more per year based on your degree, it will pay itself back in 10 years.  If I was interested enough, we could calculate the amount extra you'd have to earn if you include inflation, but it wouldn't change the calculation much.

I wish I could have my 2 years back.  I actually had to unlearn the shit they taught me.

[lastlady]

College is a scam. 

Agreed.

Results clearly show that the path of paying for a college education is clearly not worth the cost. The higher earnings later do not compensate for the money spent on tuition early on.

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:7qDXhhvzHnoJ:homepages.udayton.edu/~jenninal/aj5_Module7_PV.doc+college+degree+worthwhile+beneficial&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=5&gl=us&client=firefox-a

According to the Forbes list of the 400 wealthiest Americans, 4 out of the top 5 are college dropouts

http://willblogforfood.typepad.com/will_blog_for_food/2005/12/you_hear_all_th.html

Most people aren't going to be the "richest people in America" so that doesn't apply to most of us.  I also question the earnings versus tuition based on the fact that many people go to college and study completely unmarketable subjects like literature, sociology or <fill in the blank> studies.  I imagine such people bring the average return down further than it would be for people who study business, math, science, engineering, etc.

Just doing the math, if you go to community college for two years ($3K for 4 semesters = $12K) and a state university for 2 ($6K for 4 semesters = $24K), you've spent $36K on college.  Not counting inflation, if you earn just $3600 more per year based on your degree, it will pay itself back in 10 years.  If I was interested enough, we could calculate the amount extra you'd have to earn if you include inflation, but it wouldn't change the calculation much.

My college experience was a little different and my income did go up after I had my degree, but I don't think it was the little piece of paper that mattered. First I went to a liberal arts college where it had student directed interdisciplinary programs and the students were not graded but we evaluated ourselves and our professors. What I gained from going to school was access to all of the equipment for still photography, motion picture film, and labs, darkrooms, cameras, editing bays,  ect...

I was able to have complete access to many items that would have cost me hundreds of thousands of dollars to rent or purchase. I also was in an environment that fostered growth and learning. Of course you don't have to go to school to have a group that learns from each other, but access to the equipment and labs was for me the prize jewel. I started college later in life I think I was about 27, I really enjoyed taking the time off from working and basically spent all my time studying and creating whatever I wanted.

As far as numbers my income went up about 60% after college.

[maxxoccupancy]

A large number of people drop out of college, including myself.  Even with a BS degree, which averages just over five years nowadays, it's almost impossible to recoup the expenses.  If you could take enough AP and summer courses to get it down to three years, or work your way through school, it might make more sense.

Otherwise, you're better off just with a trade or two.

On the original topic, sort of, I am having a party at my place in Seabrook this Sunday at 5pm for those who'd like to get a look at the town--probably the most libertarian town in the seacoast region. I've got the details listed.

[lastlady]

I know this is off topic for the subject line. But following this thread, is college really all about making money. That certainly is not the reason I went to school, but I suppose this is what most people go for is to get a job and earn money.

But is this the sole purpose of "getting" an education? Are there other things one can get from school?

[J’raxis 270145]

College is a scam. 

In the past, the peasants were kept in line through lifelong, and hereditary, debt.

That’s not legal anymore. So now the system just convinces most Americans to indebt themselves, at least for a significant portion of their life, by the time they turn eighteen. And of course by the the student loans are paid off, most Americans have a mortgage… or endless credit card payments… or an expensive health crisis… or…



Ever wonder why student loans are one of the only debts—they might even be the only debt—that can’t be vacated by a bankruptcy filing?

[J’raxis 270145]

I know this is off topic for the subject line. But following this thread, is college really all about making money. That certainly is not the reason I went to school, but I suppose this is what most people go for is to get a job and earn money.

But is this the sole purpose of "getting" an education?

It is. Read John Taylor Gatto’s books on the public school systems; he talks about the true purpose of modern colleges in there, too. It’s not about getting “an education” anymore: Universities are “engines of economic growth” and it’s all about producing useful (employable… useable) skilled workers for the system.