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[vermass]

    A month ago I was all for VT. Now after a month of going through the information (wow, is there a lot of information) I've come to the conclusion: there are two groups of FSPer's, those who want NH(east) and those who want WY(west). I honestly believe that we could narrow the choice to these two states (I'm not saying we should) and make everyone happy!
     Lets get Jason to do what he did in VT in both NH and WY! For a few thousand dollars Jason could go to both of these states and "feel" them out. We need to send more money to the project. I sent $50 yesterday and next month I'm going to start a $25 a month automatic payment. Jason and the FSP aren't soliciting money, but come on people. For those of us that can afford to, we MUST financially support the FSP. It's very important for Jason to be able to get a feel for potential states. Nowhere in this forum have I seen request for money but common sense tells you they need it. Since everyone cannot afford to send money that leaves those of us who can with a responsibility to "support' our government. We have statistics coming out our ears. While statistics are important they don't tell you everything. What we need is an advance party to check out the top-choice states. It certainly looks like WY in the west and NH in the east!

[Robert H.]

I agree that it would be worth it to send Jason out on a couple more "junkets" to frontrunner states if he's willing to do that.  We could gain some invaluable insights this way.

Maybe we could find out how much it would cost to do this and post it here and on the Yahoo forum.  Whether we did it or not would then be up to whether the membership found it a worthy enough cause to support financially.  The state LP's would probably assist to some degree as well.

[vermass]

  Worthy? From one Robert to another it's got to be worthy! The reception Jason recieves is likely the one we'll recieve as a group. Having said that I would think a state would be happy to have a bunch of new citizens who won't be on welfare. 20,000 new citizens and not one welfare recipiant. I'd be soliciting the FSP!. I wonder what kind of reception WY or NH would give us. Jason could get a feel for that. I think that's huge. What if Jason went to both states. Than after he came back said: "The WY legislators loved our ideas they can't wait to work with us. I can't put into words how excited everyone was". "The NH legislators seem a bit set in their ways, they love their freedom but don't seem likely to accept us and our ideas. It really wasn't what I expected". I for one would change my top choice from NH to WY! We can argue day and night about statistics and there relevence but we must have support!

[JasonPSorens]

Regarding costs - the Vermont trip cost a little over $400; I had people to stay with and drive me around, so that kept costs low.  If I hadn't had such people, it could have been $700 (to rent a car and get hotel rooms).  But hopefully in most of the candidate states we would have people able & willing to help out in this way.

[anarchicluv]

Sign me up to help!  I'd be more than willing to drive to WY to shuttle Jason around (I live in SLC, only a few hours away).  I also have relatives in WY that may be willing to let us stay there and help show us around.

I'll also be sending some money in on the next payday.

Jeremy

[Robert H.]

 Worthy? From one Robert to another it's got to be worthy!

Oh, I agree!  I just said that in reference to whether or not most members would find it "worthy" enough to donate toward getting it done.  

It could be our first real group effort outside of recruitment.

[Robert H.]

Jason,

Perhaps instead of actually traveling to these states, as much good as that could potentially do, would it be useful to consider setting up some sort of "phone tour" with officials from these states?  In other words, you could get someone to help arrange calls with various state officials and discuss the FSP with them at that time.  It wouldn't be as personal obviously, but it could still accomplish the same basic thing - giving us a more definite idea of what we face, pro and con.

Not to mention that it would save money.  

[JasonPSorens]

A phone tour could work.  I'll have to do some research on which people I ought to get in touch with, and how I can do so.

[vermass]

  Jason, you had said before cost is the issue. So you have the time? You have the desire to do this? If it's just the cost I think all the MA FSPer's should send donations for a trip to NH. I think all the MA FSPer's would like to see NH picked. After all most FSPer's no matter how devoted they are would RATHER stay as close to their family's as possible. Also, did my plea for money make a difference? Is our budget that tight? Most FSPer's have probably had more of their money go to digging a hole through Boston than they've sent to the FSP. Another plea to THOSE WHO CAN AFFORD IT, send it to them please. Just think about it. Our little FSP "government" needs money too. At least they're doing something for US. The phone idea is better than nothing that's for sure but I'd really like to see Jason visit some more top-choice states. JMHO

[JasonPSorens]

Our budget is actually in good shape.  However, we have been saving up to do a major direct-mail campaign.  We're just waiting for word from the national LP on whether they'll be allowed by the FEC to rent to us, and how much it will cost.

I will be going to Montana in May, and Elizabeth will probably be going to N.H. in July.  So we could set up some interviews then.  It'd be nice to check out some of the other states too, of course.

[vermass]

    I think the budget is a good indicator of how commited people are. I know some can't afford to donate, that's fine as long as those who can do.
    Shouldn't the same person visit all the states? Nothing against Elizabeth by any means but it's easier for the same person to make comparisons? Either way I'm glad we're going to have someone personally check out the top states.

[Greggers69]

I was wondering if anyone had anymore info. on wy.  I was liking Evanston.  Me and my wife are gonna take a trip to Wy.  to check it out.  And also what type of jobs are there.  I would really appreciate it.  Thanks Greg

[freedomroad]

I was wondering if anyone had anymore info. on wy.  I was liking Evanston.  Me and my wife are gonna take a trip to Wy.  to check it out.  And also what type of jobs are there.  I would really appreciate it.  Thanks Greg

Evanston in Uinta County
Evanston has around 11,500 people and is around an hour from the Salt Lake City MSA.  Several small communities are within 30 minutes of Evanston (Almy, Altamont, Aspen, Leroy, Bagan, and Spring Valley).  The Pine Creek Ski Resort, Bear Lake (a very large lake), and the Fossil-Butte National Monument are all less than 2 hours north of Evanston.  Bear Creek, which offers good fishing, passes right through Evanston, while several other creeks are within a 1 hour drive.  Evanston is known for being one of the less windy larger cities in Wyoming.

It is not unheard of for folks to commute from Evanston to the Salt Lake City MSA.  The Salt Lake City MSA has over 1.1 million people and is growing at a rapid pace.  Around a dozen ski resorts and a large airport (with a Delta Airlines Hub) are located in the Salt Lake City area.  With the short commute to and airline hub in Salt Lake City, Evanston is a great place for airline personal to hang their hats.  Land values in Evanston might go up a great deal in 20-30 years when the Salt Lake City MSA moves much closer to Evanston.  Some people from the Salt Lake City area go to Evanston to buy certain things that are harder to buy in Utah.  The FSP could push to allow even more hard-to-get items sold in Evanston.  

From Evanston to other cities according to Mapquest (Mapquest usually overestimates the time it takes to travel from Western city to Western city)
1. Evanston, WY to Salt Lake City, UT; Total Distance: 81.37 miles  Total Estimated Time: 1 hour, 24 minutes

2. Evanston, WY to Ogden, UT; Total Distance: 76.63 miles  Total Estimated Time:1 hour, 20 minutes

3. Evanston, WY to Park City, UT; Total Distance: 62.61 miles  Total Estimated Time: 1 hour, 8 minutes

4. Evanston, WY to Rock Springs, WY; Total Distance: 103.19 miles  Total Estimated Time: 1 hour, 43 minutes

5. Evanston, WY to Casper, WY Total Distance: 330.00 miles  Total Estimated Time: 6 hours, 17 minutes

6. Evanston, WY to Cheyenne, WY; Total Distance: 358.40 miles  Total Estimated Time: 5 hours, 51 minutes

7. Evanston, WY to Jackson, WY; Total Distance: 190.57 miles  Total Estimated Time: 4 hours, 48 minutes

8. Evanston, WY to Rawlins, WY; Total Distance: 208.78 miles  Total Estimated Time: 3 hours, 25 minutes

9. Evanston, WY to Lander, WY; Total Distance: 210.49 miles  Total Estimated Time: 4 hours, 22 minutes

10. Evanston, WY to Laramie, WY; Total Distance: 309.34 miles  Total Estimated Time: 5 hours, 3 minutes

11. Evanston, WY to Denver, CO; (A co-worker from the area claims the drive is less than 7 hours.  This would means that the drives to Rawlins, Laramie, and Cheyenne are also shorter than listed.)
Total Distance: 451.75 miles  Total Estimated Time: 7 hours, 23 minutes

12. Evanston, WY to Grand Junction, CO; Total Distance: 293.56 miles  Total Estimated Time: 6 hours, 47 minutes

13. Evanston, WY to Boise, ID; Total Distance: 378.76 miles  Total Estimated Time: 6 hours, 15 minutes

14. Evanston, WY to Pocatello, ID; Total Distance: 204.24 miles  Total Estimated Time: 3 hours, 24 minutes

15. Evanston, WY to Provo, UT; Total Distance: 99.89 miles  Total Estimated Time: 2 hours, 1 minute

16. Evanston, WY to Las Vegas, NV; (The same co-worker from above, said this drive is just over 7 hours.)  Total Distance: 494.22 miles  Total Estimated Time: 8 hours, 5 minutes

[djl86]

Wyoming in the news lately:
Entrepreneurial seeds planted in Wyoming
Casper Star-Tribune 02/18/2003
http://www.casperstartribune.net/articles/2003/02/18/news/world/a88f182f2c3946cbac5c089bfdf51dfe.txt

No State Income Tax and $1.8 Billion Socked Away
Washington Post 02/06/2003
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A31815-2003Feb5.html

[exitus]

For those of you who have a thing for irony:
In early 1974, a New Hampshire man was ticketed for putting a piece of tape on the "Live Free or Die" motto on his license plates.  He refused to comply, was sentenced and fined four more times and even imprisoned!  After continued prosecution, a total of three years in the courts, fines, and a criminal record, Maynard received relief in federal court.   The State of New Hampshire then brought the case to the Supreme Court to force Maynard to display the motto but the Supremes affirmed the district court case in Maynard's favor.  Justices Rehnquist and Blackmun dissented on the side of New Hampshire.
U.S. Supreme Court
WOOLEY v. MAYNARD, 430 U.S. 705 (1977)


I suppose that supporters of the PETA campaign to rid Wyoming of animal cruelty license plates because of the
Bucking Horse and Rider symbol ought to take a cue from the New Hampshirites who, using simple yankee ingenuity just put a piece of tape on their plates to cover that inspiring motto on their plates when they get offended by it.

I wonder, if we go to a state other than New Hampshire if the state couldn't borrow the "Live Free or Die" motto and challenge New Hampshire to live up to it better.  The publicity from any lawsuits over copyright violation would be well worth it anyways.



The Equality State, . . .live free or die!