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Author Topic: Seditious Ramblings  (Read 114391 times)

atr

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #60 on: October 24, 2005, 10:46:09 am »

Why can't the FSP remain as the vehicle for getting liberty-lovers to move to New Hampshire...?
It can ..... it just is not doing that right now. That is why it needs to be taken back by the people.

People who want to work on getting more liberty-lovers to move to move to NH? If you have some ideas on that, you can share them. If you want to help with that, all the better. If you want to complain about "the leadership" not doing it enough, hey, I'm with you on that, but it doesn't take a takeover to work towards that goal yourself. At the same time, I'd be curious to see the current "leadership" replaced with you, Kat, Dave, Mike, Sandy, and whomever else. Would you be able to ramp up our numbers? How?
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KBCraig

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #61 on: October 24, 2005, 10:58:58 am »

The leadership looks down on us common members and is getting in the way of our goal.

We are? How?


Letter to the editor by Steve Cobb:

http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/06022005/letters/45462.htm

"Not only does the Free State Project (FSP) plan no acts of civil disobedience, it performs no change activism of any sort. Neither Russell Kanning nor Mike Fisher has any authority to speak or act on behalf of the FSP, and the FSP did not authorize their actions; we found out in the press along with everyone else."


Regarding Lauren Canario's imprisonment in New London:

http://www.infowars.com/articles/ps/eminent_domain_ft_trumbull_protestor.htm

"Amanda Phillips, the president of the Free State Project, also distanced the group from Canario, saying her imprisonment has nothing to do with the goals of the organization, which does not take a position on eminent domain."


And who can forget the whole Grafton debacle?

http://www4.fosters.com/june_2004/june_20_04/sports/ap_nh0620a.asp

"Other Free Towners and Free Staters have tried to distance themselves from Pendarvis, also known as Zack Bass, an Internet consultant who runs a Filipina mail-order bride business.

"'He’s not the kind of person that represents the Free State Project,' said Amanda Phillips, president of the Free State Project."


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atr

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #62 on: October 24, 2005, 11:04:19 am »

The leadership looks down on us common members and is getting in the way of our goal.

We are? How?


Letter to the editor by Steve Cobb:

...

Regarding Lauren Canario's imprisonment in New London:

...

And who can forget the whole Grafton debacle?

Speaking for myself, I don't believe "the leadership" looks down on its active members, or that those examples reflect any disrespect, excepting the FTP situation. And in none of those cases did the FSP organization get in the way of those actions.
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artienewport

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #63 on: October 24, 2005, 11:26:11 am »


And who can forget the whole Grafton debacle?

And in none of those cases did the FSP organization get in the way of those actions.

 ::)
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atr

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #64 on: October 24, 2005, 11:39:29 am »

And in none of those cases did the FSP organization get in the way of those actions.

Unless you're inclined to think, for example, that if the government doesn't provide food it must mean the government is against food, and we surely will all starve.
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eukreign

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #65 on: October 24, 2005, 11:51:00 am »

And in none of those cases did the FSP organization get in the way of those actions.
Unless you're inclined to think, for example, that if the government doesn't provide food it must mean the government is against food, and we surely will all starve.

Except that the whole purpose of the FSP is to get 20,000 recruits. If the FSP does a poor job recruiting people then YES WE WILL FAIL (at least fail to achieve the 20,000 liberty minded individuals moving to NH).

I can't believe you compare the FSP with government, are you saying that the FSP is just as useless, inefficient and corrupt as our government?
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atr

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #66 on: October 24, 2005, 12:00:24 pm »

And in none of those cases did the FSP organization get in the way of those actions.
Unless you're inclined to think, for example, that if the government doesn't provide food it must mean the government is against food, and we surely will all starve.

Except that the whole purpose of the FSP is to get 20,000 recruits. If the FSP does a poor job recruiting people then YES WE WILL FAIL (at least fail to achieve the 20,000 liberty minded individuals moving to NH).

I can't believe you compare the FSP with government, are you saying that the FSP is just as useless, inefficient and corrupt as our government?

The FSP is like a government in that many of its constituents want it to do things for them that are beyond the scope of its conception. Yes, the purpose is to get recruits. And like government, the FSP is blamed for not doing enough while the people take no responsibility themselves.
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artienewport

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #67 on: October 24, 2005, 12:11:21 pm »

Unless you're inclined to think, for example, that if the government doesn't provide food it must mean the government is against food, and we surely will all starve.

"'He’s not the kind of person that represents the Free State Project,' said Amanda Phillips, president of the Free State Project."

Logically, one must conclude that there ARE certian kinds of people that represent the FSP according to that quote.

Which kind of people does the FSP support then?
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freedomroad

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #68 on: October 24, 2005, 12:12:13 pm »

The FSP leadership is good people.  The problem is that the FSP membership is having a hard time getting new members to join.  Clearly, we need more people to give more hours and new ways of recruiting.  I am partly at fault for this.  We can all do a little more but it is up to us as individuals.  Maybe the leadership needs to motivate the members to work just a little harder.  
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artienewport

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #69 on: October 24, 2005, 12:13:47 pm »

The FSP is like a government in that many of its constituents want it to do things for them that are beyond the scope of its conception.

Oh, you want to bring up the scope of it's conception?

http://64.233.187.104/search?q=cache:x1Rms1eXDd4J:www.ncc-1776.com/tle2001/libe131-20010723-03.html+free+state+project+%22take+over%22+sorens&hl=en
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kater

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #70 on: October 24, 2005, 12:34:24 pm »

It can ..... it just is not doing that right now. That is why it needs to be taken back by the people.

And why would that be necessary if the NH Underground is doing such a bang-up job? 
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FTL_Ian

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #71 on: October 24, 2005, 01:06:55 pm »

Let me get this straight. Your client has discussions about the pros and cons of retaining your services, and because someone may or may not have criticized certain aspects of your show as part of that process, you want to call them out on the carpet and hold some kind of public inquisition? Disgustingly inappropriate.

I never said anything about publicly calling out anyone.  I haven't even revealed my sources.  I'm just publicly asking for my detractors to speak with me personally about their issues, so they can hopefully be resolved.  How else am I to get in touch with them, when I don't even know who they are?

Quote
I might add that reaming your client in public is not a great sign of intelligence.

My "client" is the FSP, and I've publicly thanked the FSP for sponsoring the show, perhaps you can point out where the reaming is?

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For everyone else, this is exactly the reason why some leadership conversations need to be private, and why all decent non-profits (Cato, Reason, LNC, etc.) have private Board meetings. People need to be able to express honest opinions without having the gossip faction tear them a new one.

I just wish people with negative opinions would express them to me, privately.  That's all I'm asking for.  No one's been called on the carpet.  If there's something we can do as a show to make you happier, whoever you are, we won't know what that something is unless you tell us.

Take it easy, Jason.  We still support the FSP and are proud to have the FSP as a sponsor.  I'm just bewildered by what I'm told, and this is the only way I can communicate with the mystery detractors, as I don't know who they are.
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Russell Kanning

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #72 on: October 24, 2005, 01:08:27 pm »

The leadership looks down on us common members and is getting in the way of our goal.

We are? How?
"Is that why everyone's so worked up? They want a pat on the head from the FSP any time they do anything?"

You did it 1 reply earlier. ::)
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The NH Underground - "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." -Mahatma Gandhi
New Hampshire Free Press - The Nonviolent Revolution Starts Here

"Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces." -- Etienne de La Boetie, The Politics of Obedience: The Discourse of Voluntary Servitude

Russell Kanning

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #73 on: October 24, 2005, 01:12:38 pm »

If you have some ideas on that, you can share them. Would you be able to ramp up our numbers? How?
Get out of the way of activity. I do not want to share a few ideas for the leadership to ignore. We don't need anyone in charge. We need you to stop holding the fsp back. :)
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The NH Underground - "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." -Mahatma Gandhi
New Hampshire Free Press - The Nonviolent Revolution Starts Here

"Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces." -- Etienne de La Boetie, The Politics of Obedience: The Discourse of Voluntary Servitude

Russell Kanning

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Re: Seditious Ramblings
« Reply #74 on: October 24, 2005, 01:16:37 pm »

It can ..... it just is not doing that right now. That is why it needs to be taken back by the people.

And why would that be necessary if the NH Underground is doing such a bang-up job? 
We do certain things the fsp does other things. I don't want to give up on the fsp and work around it.
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The NH Underground - "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." -Mahatma Gandhi
New Hampshire Free Press - The Nonviolent Revolution Starts Here

"Resolve to serve no more, and you are at once freed. I do not ask that you place hands upon the tyrant to topple him over, but simply that you support him no longer; then you will behold him, like a great Colossus whose pedestal has been pulled away, fall of his own weight and break in pieces." -- Etienne de La Boetie, The Politics of Obedience: The Discourse of Voluntary Servitude
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