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Author Topic: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?  (Read 8848 times)

MaineShark

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Re: Gun Laws:(or rtaher, a lcak there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #15 on: October 01, 2005, 01:30:33 pm »

They don't have to care one whit about my rights, so long as they don't infringe upon them.
But "they" already don't care, are the majority, and...as you might have noticed...are already infringing on them.

It's remarkably hard to oppress armed people...

You think open carry would survive in NH if it was put up to a vote?

Yes.  Even if they could manage a majority, and got a law on the books, so many people would openly defy the law that it would be a disaster for the state.  Then all the other laws would come into question.  No state can survive for very long if its laws are ignored by the people.

Joe
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

artienewport

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Re: Gun Laws:(or rtaher, a lcak there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #16 on: October 01, 2005, 01:51:42 pm »

It's remarkably hard to oppress armed people...

Aren't we armed now? Aren't we opressed now?!

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Even if they could manage a majority, and got a law on the books, so many people would openly defy the law that it would be a disaster for the state.

Really? I don't remember ever seeing anyone open carry in the dozens of times I've been in NH. In fact, all I've heard about it is people getting detained/arrested for doing so. Could you imagine if it actually WAS against the law?
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MaineShark

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Re: Gun Laws:(or rtaher, a lcak there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #17 on: October 01, 2005, 02:04:58 pm »

It's remarkably hard to oppress armed people...
Aren't we armed now?

No, not really.  You're no more armed because you own a gun than you are a musician because you own a guitar.

Really? I don't remember ever seeing anyone open carry in the dozens of times I've been in NH.

And where, precisely, were you in NH?

For one thing, you certainly didn't attend PorcFest, as quite the large number of people were carrying openly.

In fact, all I've heard about it is people getting detained/arrested for doing so. Could you imagine if it actually WAS against the law?

If a law like that was actually passed, more people would openly carry, as a form of protest.  You really don't have much experience with NH, do you?  "Live free or die" is not just a license plate slogan... a large percentage of the people take it very seriously.

Joe
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

artienewport

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Re: Gun Laws:(or rtaher, a lcak there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #18 on: October 01, 2005, 02:17:11 pm »

No, not really.  You're no more armed because you own a gun than you are a musician because you own a guitar.

Ok...

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And where, precisely, were you in NH?

I've been all over the state. On weekdays, weekends, holidays, summer, fall, winter, spring. Never saw a single soul open carry. Sorry?

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For one thing, you certainly didn't attend PorcFest, as quite the large number of people were carrying openly.

I have no desire to hang out with a group of people who mostly consist of those who only want SOME liberty.

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If a law like that was actually passed, more people would openly carry, as a form of protest.  You really don't have much experience with NH, do you?  "Live free or die" is not just a license plate slogan... a large percentage of the people take it very seriously.

Do people protest against the what, 8% prepared food tax by not eating out? Must have killed the restaurant business in NH. No? Where are all the insurgents? Heh. ;-)
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MaineShark

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #19 on: October 01, 2005, 02:51:32 pm »

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And where, precisely, were you in NH?
I've been all over the state. On weekdays, weekends, holidays, summer, fall, winter, spring. Never saw a single soul open carry. Sorry?

That’s not very precise.

Try again.

About the only places you could really avoid occasionally seeing people carrying is in the big cities.

And also remember that most people who carry, carry concealed.  It’s not like $10 license fee is going to stop them from getting the concealed carry license.

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For one thing, you certainly didn't attend PorcFest, as quite the large number of people were carrying openly.
I have no desire to hang out with a group of people who mostly consist of those who only want SOME liberty.

Well, I’m even more certain that you didn’t attend PorcFest, then, as there was quite a contingent of anarchists.

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If a law like that was actually passed, more people would openly carry, as a form of protest.  You really don't have much experience with NH, do you?  "Live free or die" is not just a license plate slogan... a large percentage of the people take it very seriously.
Do people protest against the what, 8% prepared food tax by not eating out? Must have killed the restaurant business in NH. No? Where are all the insurgents? Heh. ;-)

Charging a small tax on prepared food is not an equivalent infringement to telling people that they can’t carry guns.  There’s such a thing as “picking your battles,” you know...

Joe
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #20 on: October 01, 2005, 03:04:09 pm »

Why can't the statist just let us have New Hampshire? We would be out of their way then...
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artienewport

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #21 on: October 01, 2005, 06:01:53 pm »

About the only places you could really avoid occasionally seeing people carrying is in the big cities.

What makes you think I've spent my time in big cities in NH?

I've spent more time in places where you might expect people to be taking advantage of their freedom to open carry. Nary seen one yet.


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And also remember that most people who carry, carry concealed.  It’s not like $10 license fee is going to stop them from getting the concealed carry license.

I can carry concealed in a lot of states. Your point?

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There’s such a thing as “picking your battles,” you know...

What do you think of Carl Drega?
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lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #22 on: October 01, 2005, 08:13:36 pm »

I am with MaineShark: Don't tread on me.

You don't have to like my rights, but you sure as hell ain't gonna trample on 'em jes cuz you got some kinda screwy perception of 'em.

What does "Put 'em down" mean?

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MaineShark

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2005, 09:36:24 pm »

About the only places you could really avoid occasionally seeing people carrying is in the big cities.
What makes you think I've spent my time in big cities in NH?

Because you claim to never have seen anyone carrying openly, and it's a regular occurance.

I've spent more time in places where you might expect people to be taking advantage of their freedom to open carry. Nary seen one yet.

Quite frankly, that either means you are unobservant, haven't actually been where you say you've been, and as often, or you experienced something so far out of the ordinary on so many occasions that you clearly need to start picking lottery numbers, because with luck like that, you're bound to win.

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And also remember that most people who carry, carry concealed.  It’s not like $10 license fee is going to stop them from getting the concealed carry license.
I can carry concealed in a lot of states. Your point?

My point is exactly what I said it was: that most people carry concealed, rather than openly.  That doesn't mean that they will not carry openly, if someone tries to ban open carry.  Anyone tries a stunt like that, and open carry will suddenly be immensely popular.

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There’s such a thing as “picking your battles,” you know...
What do you think of Carl Drega?

Didn't really achieve much meaningful change, now did he?

Joe
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2005, 09:14:00 pm »

Ah I see now.

As for Open Carry, I have come up with an idea. Kentucky has more friendly gun-laws (they are even premepted) however, I don't commonly see people open carry.

Here a few areasons I have been given as to why people do not open carry:

#1) Police Harrasment
#2) They are afraid if people KNOW they have a gun, they will try to break in and steal it. Such things have occured, even in nice neighborhoods. However many would be theifs have been shot in their attempts...
#3) I was once advised not to open carry in my place of work because if someone tried to rob my store, I would be the first o get shot.


So: I was considering holding an event.

The even would be called "Open Carry Day: An acknowledgement of rights", at this event pamphlets concerning Open Carry, Firearms Saftey and common Myths about firearms and firearms ownerships would be avaialble. Demonstrations and possibly even a shooting contest!

One T-Shirt I am working on is an "OpenCarry.org" T-shirt, any advice for slogans would be nice.

Also: Anyone in kentucky wishing to assist in organizing this event would be welcome.

Some place with a shooting range would be nice.

I will probably start a new thread later when I have more input.
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MaineShark

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2005, 09:28:20 pm »

#2) They are afraid if people KNOW they have a gun, they will try to break in and steal it. Such things have occured, even in nice neighborhoods. However many would be theifs have been shot in their attempts...

'Round here, you just assume that everyone has a gun.

#3) I was once advised not to open carry in my place of work because if someone tried to rob my store, I would be the first o get shot.

Uh, someone would have to be pretty determined to rob that particular store.  In most cases, a robber would just move on to easier pickin's, if he saw someone carrying.

So: I was considering holding an event.

The even would be called "Open Carry Day: An acknowledgement of rights", at this event pamphlets concerning Open Carry, Firearms Saftey and common Myths about firearms and firearms ownerships would be avaialble. Demonstrations and possibly even a shooting contest!

One T-Shirt I am working on is an "OpenCarry.org" T-shirt, any advice for slogans would be nice.

Also: Anyone in kentucky wishing to assist in organizing this event would be welcome.

Some place with a shooting range would be nice.

I will probably start a new thread later when I have more input.

That even already exists.  We call it "PorcFest" :)

Joe
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"An armed society is a polite society" - this does not mean that we are polite because we fear each other.

We are not civilized because we are armed; we are armed because we are civilized..

lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #26 on: October 03, 2005, 07:36:20 am »

I am gonna have to check out PorcFEST... sigh we have Freedom Fest down here... but it has very little to do with freedom and more to do with the buying and selling of Cotton Candy and Firewroks...

As for the three reasons above for not Open Carrying, these are reasons I have been given by people who say they do not open carry... I don't agree with any of them.


Hmmm, what about an "Open Carry Card" which can be handed to the police when the hassle you for open carrying?

Open Carry Card

Dear Officer

You may not be aware but Peacable Open Carry: Or the carrying of a firearm in plain sight, is perfectly legal in (state your county or state) I am a US Citizen who is legally permitted to own a firearm. My carrying of a firearm is in NO WAY a statement of intent to do harm to persons or property but rather a statement to those that would do harm to me.
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lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #27 on: October 03, 2005, 07:56:38 am »

Hmmm, this may be of no use...however. I direct you to 18 USC 241.

§ 241. Conspiracy against rights
Release date: 2005-08-03

If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; or
If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured—
They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.

Read that carefully...

"If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same"


The US Patriot ACT may be illegal soley upon these grounds... The Bush Administration may IN DEED be guilty of a high crime...
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SteveA

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #28 on: October 03, 2005, 01:38:20 pm »

Hmmm, this may be of no use...however. I direct you to 18 USC 241.

§ 241. Conspiracy against rights
Release date: 2005-08-03

If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; or
If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured—
They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.

Read that carefully...

"If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same"


The US Patriot ACT may be illegal soley upon these grounds... The Bush Administration may IN DEED be guilty of a high crime...

Notice this doesn't solely apply to citizens either.

Thank you for posting this.
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"Fruitless, born a thousand times, lies barren.  Unguided inspiration, yields random motion, circumscribed in destination, going nowhere.  Guidance uninspired, always true in facing, stands immobile.  But fixed upon that destination firmly and with inspiration lofted; beget your dreams."

lordpoee

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Re: Gun Laws:(or Rather, a lack there of) Improving in New Hampshire?
« Reply #29 on: October 03, 2005, 03:59:29 pm »

It applies to anyone within a State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District: Notice POSSESSION, such an example would be Guantanamo Bay. The US Patriot Act gives the president power to hold suspects wihtout charging them: An act expressly forbidden by the Bill of Rights. (Quck and Speedy Trial) THAT is a right. Which means the president and anyone who voted for the US Patriot Act has conspired to violate the rights of those entitled to them.
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