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Author Topic: liberal whining about delaware  (Read 10427 times)

JasonPSorens

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liberal whining about delaware
« on: August 16, 2002, 01:03:44 pm »

I found this article in The New Republic about Delaware amusing. The
establishment-leftist author is absolutely enraged at Delaware's "history
of disloyalty."


http://www.tnr.com/doc.mhtml?i=20020819&s=chait081902
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"Educate your children, educate yourselves, in the love for the freedom of others, for only in this way will your own freedom not be a gratuitous gift from fate. You will be aware of its worth and will have the courage to defend it." --Joaquim Nabuco (1883), Abolitionism

Uncle Deedah

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2002, 01:58:43 pm »

Hardly any secret that I really like Delaware, so it makes sense that the New Republic would hate it, LOL.

Sure would be nice to see the FSP pick that tiny state, imagine the movement for sound constitutional government taking hold just a few miles south from where the whole movement for freedom began back in 1776. Poetic justice.

Plus, when folks get discouraged a nice day trip to Independance Hall, Carpenter's Hall, and the Liberty Bell would help set things into perspective.
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Charley

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2002, 02:54:32 pm »

Before yall get too enamored with Delaware pls make an effort to read the Wilmington News Journal and look at the budgets for Delaware and Wilmington.
 Delaware is like 2 different states divided by the C&D canal.  North of the canal is like Baltimore or DC and south is like western VA or rural PA.
 In the past 10 years liberal democrats have come to dominate the state government and the elected federal reps.  The republican reps who remain are not conservative. It would probably take more than 100,000 FS emigrees to change the balance of power.  The price of real estate would make this a difficult task.

 
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Charley in WC

wilaygarn

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2002, 08:35:18 am »

Excuse me if this is the wrong place to post this, I am new here. I am unfamilliar with this bulletin board layout.  Feel free to advise me.

A good friend of mine says the Delaware is "owned" by DuPont, whether that is the corporation or the family I am not sure, but he believes their money and power could counter almost any number of immigrants.

I think geographially speaking, Delaware is very good, but I don't think the rulers in the Disstrict of Criminals would tolerate upstarts so close to home. True, they might not be able to do anything legally against it, but I recall a good deal of illegality being committed by that bunch.

I have a couple of comments about Vermont but I'm thinking it should be in a seperate thread.  It's time for me to go now, I'll be back!
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ChrisforLiberty

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2002, 11:53:44 pm »

DuPont the company was founded by Eleuthère Irénée du Pont in 1802. Its first products were gunpowder and explosives. I've heard but have not been able to confirm that Du Pont is one of the biggest underwriters of the War on Drugs dating back at least to WWII when they feared hemp production would threaten their Nylon business.  
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Eddie_Bradford

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2002, 10:28:31 am »

In responce to Charley, I agree Delaware's native culture is the most worrysome aspect of this state IMO but you're wrong that we would need 100,000 people.  I think you'll agree because their one house of Rep. Castle is a Republican who won in 1998 with about 2/3 of the vote.  Oh yeah and he only got 119,811 votes.  On off presidential year elections Delaware's total voting population is just a tiny hair more than Wyoming.  In 1994 There were actually more votes cast in Wyoming than in Delaware.  Also remember until recently Delaware had Roth as a Republican Senator of Roth IRA fame.  Roth IRAs make me very very happy and there are many insurance and business related lobbies.  As for the other Senator I think he's was installed by some DC lawyers and liberals probably taking advantage of the easy ability to win a Senate seat in such a small state with a relatively small amount of money.  Anyway the Rs win by bigger margins than the Ds it seems.  I think the most important thing is that we can take over the whole state government with only 26% of the vote.  For example in 1998 there were about 180,000 voters who voted for their Congressman.  Let's assume all of these people also voted in the local state races too, since the congressional election wasn't very contested this isn't a bad assumption I think (even though less people usually vote in these type of elections)  So that means that we need to win half of the seats in the house and Senate  Theoretically (if everyone was possitioned in the right places) this could be done with only 45,000 votes (50,000 after we move there)  That means each one of us would need to convince 1.5 other people to vote for our candidate.  This really doesn't seem to be that hard, and since we'll raise lots of money that will surely help.
-Eddie
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JasonPSorens

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #6 on: August 22, 2002, 07:26:12 pm »

This evening there was a "Crossfire" debate between the whinging Chait and Delaware's lone Representative about the virtues and vices of Delaware.  It was rather amusing, but didn't generate a whole lot of light. ;)
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bud

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2002, 05:48:23 am »

ChrisforLiberty,

You live in a state with an idiot for governor?  That doesn't narrow it down very much for us.
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ChrisforLiberty

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2002, 11:18:33 am »


ChrisforLiberty,

You live in a state with an idiot for governor?  That doesn't narrow it down very much for us.


I'm from the state that Al Gore claims to be from.
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The elitists fear an ever growing political advocacy that is present in the common man and woman. It offends their sense of the class structure and their own morally corrupt world view. What better way to maintain this elitist structure than to indoctrinate a child at a very early age?

Otosan

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2002, 11:43:41 am »

ChrisforLiberty:

I have the same idiot for gov as you do, and it looks like we have a choice between dum and dummer this  time around.
:(  :(  

And do not get me started on our great selection for Senator!    :P

(NE 10ec)  ;D
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Wild Pegasus

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2002, 12:58:40 pm »

While it must be encouraging to you that Mike Castle got in with only 120k votes, I should point out that 20k is only 1/6 of that.  Even with all of you voting, even if all of you drag someone else along to vote with you, that leaves you with 40k votes.  That won't win you the governorship, the Senate, or the House.

One other thing to point out is that, if it looks like extremists are going to be elected, the other part(y/ies) will have higher turnout to keep the extremists out of office.  This has been shown numerous times in American politics, and most recently, in the French election between Chirac and Le Pen.  20k is a nice start, but it's not going to get you a win anywhere.  If you guys get too close to winning, people are going to turn out en masse to keep you from winning.  Of course, all of this is predicated on the idea that the voting counting is done fairly, which may be an issue in and of itself.

Boss Tweed's First Observation: They can vote for whoever they like, as long as I count the votes.

As for the DuPonts owning Delaware, Delaware politics are under the control of the chemical and banking industries.  Big corporations are not interested in the free market at all, and since the state apparatus pays big returns, they will invest heavily to whip you.

Boss Tweed's Second Observation: They can vote for whoever they like, as long as I pick the candidates.

Give up on Delaware, seriously.

- Josh
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JasonPSorens

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2002, 02:20:36 pm »

Actually, all you need to win in a close 3-way race is about 35%.  In any state people might turn out en masse to oppose us if we go in there like gangbusters without doing our homework first.  We'll have to start by affecting the state's political culture & gaining political experience at the local level.
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"Educate your children, educate yourselves, in the love for the freedom of others, for only in this way will your own freedom not be a gratuitous gift from fate. You will be aware of its worth and will have the courage to defend it." --Joaquim Nabuco (1883), Abolitionism

Elizabeth

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2002, 02:37:14 pm »


While it must be encouraging to you that Mike Castle got in with only 120k votes, I should point out that 20k is only 1/6 of that.


You mention the 20K number, but you may not have read why that number was chosen:
http://www.freestateproject.com/strategies.htm
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Wild Pegasus

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2002, 05:08:20 pm »

I did read the strategies page.  What I am trying to point out is that is all fine and good when the politicians are generally inoffensive centrist suits.  When you're talking about dismantling public schools, ending state support of business, and severing the cord between the state's residents and the middle class federal welfare programs, you're talking about the kind of beliefs which, though right, scare the living hell out of people.  Running those political races scares people who would otherwise not bother to vote to the polls under the "I don't like this jackass, but I won't let those nuts take away <x>." philosophy.

If you follow the "local races mean experience" branch, you'll end up like the Libertarian Party schmucks who get appointed to dogcatcher or the local planning board and end up doing nothing to advance liberty, making the whole movement a waste of time.  Or, if you run as a third party on an inoffensive government reduction platform, you may even get elected.  But you won't get anything done since every program cut means a fight with those who benefit from it, and the media will savage your every effort.  You'll be out and for good the next cycle.

There's simply nothing for the broader liberty movement to gain through electoral politics.

- Josh
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JasonPSorens

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Re:liberal whining about delaware
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2002, 07:00:21 pm »

There is no alternative to electoral politics.  We are all here interested in changing the laws.  Politicians make the laws.  The only way to change the laws is to change the politicians.  There are two ways to change the politicians: 1) defeating them at the ballot box; 2) killing them.  Apparently you prefer the latter.  I think that's lunacy.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2002, 07:00:43 pm by Jason P. Sorens »
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"Educate your children, educate yourselves, in the love for the freedom of others, for only in this way will your own freedom not be a gratuitous gift from fate. You will be aware of its worth and will have the courage to defend it." --Joaquim Nabuco (1883), Abolitionism
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