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Author Topic: I want NH! But convince me I'm right  (Read 5429 times)

Aftershock00

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I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« on: August 13, 2015, 06:43:53 pm »

Hello everyone. First post here. I signed the pledge about four months ago and have a five year plan to move out of Long Island New York. I really would appreciate your feedback...the good,bad and ugly.

So I live in the nanny state of New York. I make decent money, own a mortgaged home, and have a decent life, but I'm still not happy and here is why...

i am a strong believer in the constitution and the second amendment...New York wipes their ass with that...

I am a strong believer of live and let live. Your right to be free includes my right to be free from you.
I know Long Island is a big wasteful bureaucracy. Cops making 150k a year a more, teachers and county employees too. Just no accountability, and a lot of hustling the system. I have .25 acre property and pay 10k a year in taxes, and that's considered low! Meanwhile our streets are ridden with potholes and traffic from poor bureaucrat city planning
I believe in freedom and personal responsibility. I like the no helmet laws, no seat belt laws, and fight against dwi checkpoints which are unconstitutional. I believe adults should be allowed to be as smart or stupid as they want to be.  If I want to eat ten pounds of bacon a day, the government shouldn't be banning it and I should be able to suffer the consequences.
I hate the New York welfare state. You have noooooo idea how prevalent the welfare hustle is in Long Island.it is literally a lifestyle that people are proud of, and the tax payers subsidize.
I have no children yet, but I am anti common core.

I consider myself libertarian at heart. I don't necessarily endorse gay marriage or marijuana smoking, but I don't believe I should have a say in what makes people happy and how they recreate.
I want to wean my fiancé and I off the grid somewhat....owning at least five acres of land.

But here's my real question when it comes to the free state project libertarian movement....
As a libertarian, I believe people should be free to do and live how they are happy...even if I don't necessarily agree with it. I want to be sure if I move to NH that there isn't confusion between libertarianism and liberalism.

Now this is going to come off wrong so please don't be offended, but I want to make sure there isn't people who are gay and or potheads, but detest the second amendment. I want to make sure that as libertarians, we accept ALL aspects of freedom and constitution....and America...not just the parts that pertain to/affect us.

I'm sorry but living in ny, I have this nightmare of all the liberal gay stoner hippies from the village flocking to NH, but then being like, we don't want guns man, we want peace and love man...we have to ban trucks man, were destroying the environment man,etc. again, I'm being slightly sarcastic, and I get along with all groups of people, but I'm so fearful of liberals...and I know there are aspects of NH and libertarianism that liberal minded people would flock to.
Can someone set me straight as to the general NH consensus as to what the goal of the free state project is.
Thank you in advance for your posts.



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Bounds Family

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2015, 07:16:40 pm »

I am feeling your concern and it is validated. I wrote the post, I believe, just before you. Currently I know no one in FSP and have many questions. I have done a ton of research and feel I am making the right move. We both feel the pain of where we live even though there are many positives as well. I have no interest in a Liberal imposed life or community. I have a baby on the way and have to make a choice. My choice is to get out of CA before my son is born so I don't find a reason to stay after, because it's easier. So basically if we stay in touch I can give you the straight scoop, first hand, through my transition. Hopefully that will help and you can count on truth not salesmanship. Good luck.
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elkingrey

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2015, 07:45:03 pm »

I've written and rewritten my story on this forum so many times I just don't have the energy to do it again. Long story short, my wife and I moved from CA to NH 4 years ago. A year later my parents moved. And a year after that my sister moved.

I can tell you without a shadow of a doubt that NH is for you.

Click on my name to read my past posts for greater in dept knowledge. I sincerely hope you move and move soon.

Godspeed!

Aftershock00

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2015, 07:53:45 pm »

Thank you so much for your response. Being in Cali, I'm sure you can feel my pain. All the rules and regulations, the welfare and crime, the bureaucrat hustle/exploitation.

I don't want to come off as some white trash redneck with a pickup truck that blows a trail of black smoke and a couch on my front yard, lol.
I am college educated, climbed the ladder through hard work in the merit based private sector, and take pride in what I do and how I life.

I love outdoors. I love motocross, drag racing, guns, snowmobiles, hiking , fishing, mountain biking, off roading, working with my hands (which I don't do for a living), Bon fires, and most of all, being left the F alone without some cop telling me I broke some stupid law that makes no sense. I am careful and accountable in everything I do.  But around here, laws only apply to the people, not the law enforcers.
The cops will chase you down like bin laden if you ride a dirt bike in the local woods or even shoot a BB gun! ...be guns are considered firearms in Long Island and can be punished as if I was shooting an AR. Get caught riding a dirt bike and they will impound your ride and fine they hell out of you. There is no legal place to ride on county land in Long Island.   But cops...they stay out til the bars close, drive piss drunk, drag race their cars and motorcycles (which they all have cause they make six figures) and have expired registrations, poach deer in local woods, drive without hands free phones, and essentially, live a life of lawlessness. This is not to say I'm anti cop, but there is serious corruption here and the double standard boils my blood.
The current Long Island lifestyle is so fake and phony. Nobody really owns  or can afford anything they have but they all have nice new stuff. They county put traffic cameras up that take your picture regardless of violating a law, and it all goes into a database.
And I'm so sick of the political correctness!!!! I'm a third generation guinea (Italian) . My family assimilated to America which is why we can't even speak Italian lol. The illegal immigration is rampant and destroying jobs and even side jobs. They're filling our schools and pack ten kids into a single family home and somehow us Americans have to walk on egg shells about offending them by accident.
I was so surprised/disappointed when the university of NH came out with that rule book about not saying your American cause it's offensive.

The kids on Long Island aren't out on their bikes or playing hockey in the street, they're inside playing video games. They have no idea how to use a knife, turn a screw driver, start a fire, mow a lawn, care for animals, grill a burger, etc. all they know is academic stuff and MySpace.
Although I believe in education, I am becoming a firm believer that society is taking a reverse direction where your typical man skills/survival skills are more important. There is literally 21 yr old "men" that don't know how to change a flat tire. Everyone is a sheep. 
Ever see that kids movie Wall-e....well that is what society is becoming. A bunch of mind numb dependent sheep looking for a big brother to shelter them from the big bad scary world.

And the fact that the kardashians are celebrities and Bruce Jenner gets a "most courageous" award meanwhile our veterans are coming back without arms and legs for the sake of our freedom, grrrr....don't get me started.
I really just want to disconnect as much as possible. I want a son but won't have one unless he gets to live in reality...not this liberal induced coma we call New York.
Lol, if you can't tell, I'm sick of New York.
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Aftershock00

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2015, 08:13:22 pm »

Let me be clear that my fiancé and I watched the 101 reasons to move and embrace all of it. But like stated earlier, I worry that some people will come for only a few opportunistic reasons, and then try to destroy the rest...such as my example with the gays or stoners coming for their "freedom" (which is fine and dandy), but then going all Michael bloomberg on gun rights and going all tree hugger on my outdoor rights.

So sad in ny, took my 6 months to get a concealed carry permit (the only way to legally posses a pistol) , which forces me to register them, and I can't even carry it for self defense...only when going from home to the range. Can only put 7 rounds in my 10 round magazine.  In New York, the criminals run the show.

I truly believe in the live free or die philosophy and the don't tread on me philosophy. I just hope NH doesn't get corrupted by all the surrounding northeast liberal states. But as everyone who knows me knows, I am taking this NH possibility very seriously.
I look forward to being a part of this forum and getting to know all of you. Hopefully meet some of you in person before we move. I'm thinking somewhere in southwest NH.
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elkingrey

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2015, 11:09:59 pm »

NH couldn't be more different than NY. All of the things you want to do here you can almost always do without permission. Even the democrats here enjoy guns and snowmobiles.

I can't speak for the NON-free staters that move to NH, but the free staters here are pro freedom, even for the freedoms they don't care to exercise. So, you'll never have to worry about any fellow free staters being anti-gun on you.

That being said, about 50% of us, myself included, are anarcho-capitalists. We're done with the entire notion of "country." We don't believe The State has any authority to say who can and cannot live here. And we don't like the troops or cops. They're just the enforcement wing of a fascist police state. They're our biggest enemies as they're the only ones who actually pose a serious threat to individual freedom.

Hope that helps clarify how things are here.

Aftershock00

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2015, 08:56:38 am »

Thanks for the reply. Yes it certainly does clarify things. I will definitely be taking part in the other threads and searching old ones to really get the full picture as well.

I'm new to the term anarcho capitalist. Is there a place I can go to get an overview of the whole mentality of it...or can you explain some more?

Are you implying New Hampshire should secede from the country? Have no laws at all? If we don't have capitalism, what would we have ?
I'm more in favor of very limited federal government and letting the states do their thing. I'm also in favor of states being minimalist as well. I do believe there has to be some kind of slight structure, mainly cause I don't see how it could be done otherwise....especially with so many people already being accustomed to be sheep.

I'm definitely open to new ideas tho.

Also, I didn't really see what the game plan was for when the free staters "activate" in a few years.
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elkingrey

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2015, 03:33:51 pm »

Once 20,000 people sign the pledge, the move will "trigger." That means that the pledge signers have 5 years to move to New Hampshire. Some people, like myself, decided to move early, even though the 20,000 number hasn't yet been reached.

If you move to New Hampshire you'll meet many anarcho-capitalists and they'll all have good resources for information. But since I got you first I'll give you mine.  ;D

The book that converted me from minarchist (like you are now) to anarcho-capitalist was For A New Liberty by Murray Rothbard. You can find it online for free or purchase it in hardback form.

Also, I created a website several years ago that has a ton of excellent resources. It's for anarchists, by anarchists, however, so you're not going to find very much "anarchy 101" there. It's dailyanarchist.com

Lastly, if you're on reddit, check out reddit.com/r/anarcho_capitalism

JasonPSorens

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2015, 08:46:11 pm »

Free Staters are a diverse bunch in terms of lifestyles and personal views, but united on political philosophy. We strongly support 2A rights as well as your right to be left alone to pursue peaceful activities with other consensual adults. We have everyone from theologically conservative Christians to people who consume marijuana recreationally to people who practice polyamory, and everything in between, but we are all united on the view that government should leave people alone unless they're violating others' rights.
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"Educate your children, educate yourselves, in the love for the freedom of others, for only in this way will your own freedom not be a gratuitous gift from fate. You will be aware of its worth and will have the courage to defend it." --Joaquim Nabuco (1883), Abolitionism

Ambitious Ant

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2015, 12:02:17 am »

Is anyone going to tell Aftershock that people on this site have invited/welcomed liberals to NH? I agree with the guy -- if you don't agree with freedoms for ALL and ALL freedoms (within reason), it's best you don't move. Especially under the guise/assumption/label of the FSP. I too have my reservations, mainly because I've been people like "Sure! Liberals are welcome 100%!", rather than, "If you can agree to (insert libertarian ideal here), sure!".
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JasonPSorens

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2015, 09:43:41 am »

I haven't seen anyone welcome left-progressives as FSP participants, any more than I've seen any welcome traditional right-conservatives as FSP participants. How could they agree to the Statement of Intent?
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"Educate your children, educate yourselves, in the love for the freedom of others, for only in this way will your own freedom not be a gratuitous gift from fate. You will be aware of its worth and will have the courage to defend it." --Joaquim Nabuco (1883), Abolitionism

Ambitious Ant

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2015, 10:12:43 am »

I haven't seen anyone welcome left-progressives as FSP participants, any more than I've seen any welcome traditional right-conservatives as FSP participants. How could they agree to the Statement of Intent?
Let me find the thread for you. It'll be in your inbox.
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Ambitious Ant

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #12 on: August 18, 2015, 10:19:57 am »

Here is the link for the thread. Jason, you'll find the same in your inbox.
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bigqueue

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2015, 07:08:30 pm »

Well....I think you are making the right decision coming to NH, though I do think you are preaching to the quior a bit posting here.
Having said that, the good things in life are nor free....and when we all move here, we do need to rollup our sleeves...and quite honestly, tha in an of itself will make it all worth it.......because we will be together with other like minded folks working to make a difference.

I just bought a house in Conway NH, and I am definately going to move at some point.....I am close to retirement, and will certainly come when that happens...but earlier I hope too.

NH is a great state.....you will love it.....I currently live in Mass, and I think Mass is a lot like NY.....and I will not miss it for even a minute!

-Quentin


Hello everyone. First post here. I signed the pledge about four months ago and have a five year plan to move out of Long Island New York. I really would appreciate your feedback...the good,bad and ugly.

So I live in the nanny state of New York. I make decent money, own a mortgaged home, and have a decent life, but I'm still not happy and here is why...

i am a strong believer in the constitution and the second amendment...New York wipes their ass with that...

I am a strong believer of live and let live. Your right to be free includes my right to be free from you.
I know Long Island is a big wasteful bureaucracy. Cops making 150k a year a more, teachers and county employees too. Just no accountability, and a lot of hustling the system. I have .25 acre property and pay 10k a year in taxes, and that's considered low! Meanwhile our streets are ridden with potholes and traffic from poor bureaucrat city planning
I believe in freedom and personal responsibility. I like the no helmet laws, no seat belt laws, and fight against dwi checkpoints which are unconstitutional. I believe adults should be allowed to be as smart or stupid as they want to be.  If I want to eat ten pounds of bacon a day, the government shouldn't be banning it and I should be able to suffer the consequences.
I hate the New York welfare state. You have noooooo idea how prevalent the welfare hustle is in Long Island.it is literally a lifestyle that people are proud of, and the tax payers subsidize.
I have no children yet, but I am anti common core.

I consider myself libertarian at heart. I don't necessarily endorse gay marriage or marijuana smoking, but I don't believe I should have a say in what makes people happy and how they recreate.
I want to wean my fiancé and I off the grid somewhat....owning at least five acres of land.

But here's my real question when it comes to the free state project libertarian movement....
As a libertarian, I believe people should be free to do and live how they are happy...even if I don't necessarily agree with it. I want to be sure if I move to NH that there isn't confusion between libertarianism and liberalism.

Now this is going to come off wrong so please don't be offended, but I want to make sure there isn't people who are gay and or potheads, but detest the second amendment. I want to make sure that as libertarians, we accept ALL aspects of freedom and constitution....and America...not just the parts that pertain to/affect us.

I'm sorry but living in ny, I have this nightmare of all the liberal gay stoner hippies from the village flocking to NH, but then being like, we don't want guns man, we want peace and love man...we have to ban trucks man, were destroying the environment man,etc. again, I'm being slightly sarcastic, and I get along with all groups of people, but I'm so fearful of liberals...and I know there are aspects of NH and libertarianism that liberal minded people would flock to.
Can someone set me straight as to the general NH consensus as to what the goal of the free state project is.
Thank you in advance for your posts.
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Aftershock00

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Re: I want NH! But convince me I'm right
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2015, 10:15:06 pm »

Thanks again for the replies. I'm a little confused about the preaching to the choir comment. Care to explain a little?

I understand that the FSP is a libertarian movement which is why I was so drawn to it and pledged.

My point is that it is easy to draw people in that love certain aspects of freedom, and pick and chose not only what they think is right, but what they think is right for you.

Like said earlier, for me, there is a huge difference between what I agree with as being good/bad/effective etc, and what is right, free and constitutional.

I believe it's better for health that we no longer have smoking allowed in bars or restaurants, but I believe it should be the private owners choice to determine if his or her bar allows smoking and let capitalism and free markets decide the outcome.
I think In Nyc, a place ridden with gangster thugs, that stop and frisk does work to make the streets safer , without a doubt. But just cause it works, doesn't mean it's ok to trample on people rights, therefore I believe stop and frisk is wrong.
Liberals seem to focus only on the positive results without regard for what rights its trampling on.
Once we set a precedent that a law can be enacted for our own good and safety, well, that is a terrifying slope as the limits are endless.

So I hope that liberals realize they have to swallow the whole thing. A liberal coming to NH for solely their rights and objectives would be as silly as me going to some red Bible Belt super Christian state just for the 2nd rights. Sure I'll get my gun rights, but I might get the hardcore Christian thing too.

I digress, but I'm just hoping that as libertarians, we are on the same page that limited government and freedom to be free of each other are our number one objective. I hope we all agree that we should be tolerant of each other's beliefs and values, but not be expected to agree with them.

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