Free State Project Forum

FSP -- General Discussion => Prospective Participants => Topic started by: Danarchist on April 19, 2018, 11:47:14 pm

Title: What's holding you back?
Post by: Danarchist on April 19, 2018, 11:47:14 pm
Why haven't you moved yet? I've been on the fence a while. My two reasons: the abortion debate and losing family.

FAMILY: basically missing the kids
I tend to live in Arizona. I say "tend" because I've lived for short periods in other areas. Right now I'm in Mexico studying. If I move to NH I'll be away from family. Sadly, as my perspectives have improved (religious and political), I've become more distant from my family, but I love to be with my nieces and nephews. It would be sad for me not to see them grow up.

I love working with kids and have worked in education in many ways. I would like to continue that, but in a voluntarist manner. Perhaps being around other kids would help fill what I suppose is a parental need, since I don't have any children, myself. Maybe I can find love out there in NH and we could start a family.

ABORTION: harder to find friends once there
If I move nearly cross-continent, it would be nice if there were more people l can relate to. I just can't relate to people who think abortion for convenience or comfort, especially Libertarians, who I should expect to be more rational and value the NAP. (I say rational because, while emotion is useful for creating values for you, such as life, your rationality should be scrutinizing your ideas to decide if they are internally consistent. I can't prove abortion is wrong in a laboratory, but I can prove, to an honest person, that his/her established ideas are internally inconsistent.) I met some pro-life Libertarians at Porcfest almost two years ago. I know there are a lot out there. But it's a bummer thinking they're a minority of an already small minority. Do I want to help with a movement whose members tend to favor abortion for bad reasons? I'm not even an absolutist with abortion. There could be rare situations where a NAP-loyal person could do it. But "I wasn't in the mood for a condom" is not one of those.

Perhaps there is more hope for convincing Libertarians to give up abortion than there is convincing Republicans to give up their NAP violations. In a free society, many abortions could possibly be avoided (less red tape for adoption, etc.). There are probably more people in NH, however few, that I CAN relate to, than anywhere else. There are Libertarian get-togethers in AZ but I'm not interested in the few events I can find on

Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: KDus on April 20, 2018, 12:45:09 pm
My experience suggests that family ties are far less important than we want to believe. I would have preferred the support of freedom oriented people, when I've needed family; and they didn't step up. Those ties seem to continue to weaken over time. Very few of my, large, extended family keep in communication, for the reasons you mentioned.

I remind you of the point of the FSP. Nobody will compel you to agree on abortion. It doesn't matter if you are in a minority because the principles of limited government and self ownership prevail.
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: Danarchist on April 20, 2018, 03:06:50 pm
Thank you for your reply.

It's the kids I'd miss the most. They are the greatest source of happiness I have (of the oxytocin variety). I don't see any substitute for them in NH unless I procreate.

Regarding abortion, even a Libertarian government isn't totally live-and-let-live. If something's illegal, group A is taking group B's money to target people from group B. If it's legal, group B is taking money from group A to protect people in group B. It would be great to have a law that would declare an industry, etc. extra-legal, as in, neither targeted nor subsidized by the government. They have to fend for themselves. This would be useful for controversial industries. After all the bad things that have happened or almost happened to my family and friends, because people choose to drink alcohol, I wouldn't want my money paying cops to respond to crimes in bars or liquor stores, for example.
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: Levi on April 30, 2018, 10:13:18 pm
Lots of us in NH believe abortion is wrong. 

Regarding family, that is a choice everyone has to make.  I am close to my family but I moved to NH even though it would put my nearest blood relative 1,000 miles away.  People leave families and move across oceans for freedom, opportunity, religion, ideas, and various other reasons.   
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: starrychloe on May 12, 2018, 07:36:42 pm
Children are the property of their parents and can be disposed of at will. If you try to stop a woman from having an abortion, you will be aggressing  against her. Perhaps you believe the woman is aggressing against her fetus?  The woman is autonomous and self-sufficient, whereas the fetus is not. Aggressing against an autonomous and self-sufficient person is a greater violation than aggressing against a non-autonomous, dependent person, therefore abortion shall be permitted.
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: Danarchist on May 23, 2018, 11:50:51 pm
When did you stop being property?
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: starrychloe on June 13, 2018, 11:10:11 pm
According to Constance's theory of consent, when I was able to support myself. This definition allows for high functioning emancipated 'minors' and low functioning developmentally delayed 'adults'.
Title: Re: What's holding you back?
Post by: Russell Kanning on May 05, 2019, 07:10:09 pm
Libertarian government?