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FSP -- General Discussion => Prospective Participants => Topic started by: FormulaXFD on August 31, 2012, 03:57:46 pm

Title: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on August 31, 2012, 03:57:46 pm
In reading up on gun laws from the front page, I learned that if my weapons were in the u-haul and I went through MA to get to NH, I could get busted seriously with multiple felony counts for breeching some stupid law of theirs by just transporting lawfully owned firearms across the border (even in their cases, locked). Learning of this, in spite of the FOPA, are there any other states which are similarly Tyrannical that I have to avoid on the way over from Oregon?
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Bazil on August 31, 2012, 04:12:30 pm
New Jersey, I believe, maybe NY as well,  but you can't get to NH by land (staying within the US) without passing through NY.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on August 31, 2012, 05:03:49 pm
Go by way of NY/Vermont instead of Mass.

That's the current gameplan, but only helps me so far as NY-Vermont. If, say, Illinois does the same thing, I'd be in a pickle.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on August 31, 2012, 06:07:39 pm
In reading up on gun laws from the front page, I learned that if my weapons were in the u-haul and I went through MA to get to NH, I could get busted seriously with multiple felony counts for breeching some stupid law of theirs by just transporting lawfully owned firearms across the border (even in their cases, locked). Learning of this, in spite of the FOPA, are there any other states which are similarly Tyrannical that I have to avoid on the way over from Oregon?

Not true at all. Carry a printout of FOPA with you to be safe, but I wouldn't worry about it. People routinely travel with guns through both MA and NY under FOPA, and it's not a concern. Even strongly anti-gun IL honors FOPA.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felon
Post by: slothman on August 31, 2012, 06:12:08 pm
I know someone who would want to travel through NY to get to MA.
He knows that NY does prohibit travel with guns between MA and PA/OH.
I don't know about VT but obviously with MA and NY you either have to go the ocean to ME or inside Canada.
I don't know about the laws in Canada but with all those 'A's it can't be good.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felon
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on August 31, 2012, 06:17:27 pm
I know someone who would want to travel through NY to get to MA.
He knows that NY does prohibit travel with guns between MA and PA/OH.
I don't know about VT but obviously with MA and NY you either have to go the ocean to ME or inside Canada.
I don't know about the laws in Canada but with all those 'A's it can't be good.

Your friend is misinformed about NY. But you really don't want to try taking guns into Canada.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: 10stateswithnh on September 01, 2012, 03:59:24 am
I've only heard of two exceptions to a person needing a carry license to transport a lawfully owned gun through the state of NY, which they don't give to nonresidents. One of the exceptions was if you're going to a registered gun event in NY (i.e. the event organizers had to tell the state government they were holding the event), someone on a forum or online somewhere told me about another exception but I don't recall now what it was. The fact that you are moving to another state and just passing through, as far as I know, is not an exception to their carry license requirement.  By the way, what is FOPA?

Illinois doesn't prevent transporting a gun (unloaded, but it has no provision for concealed carry legally, the only state to still be this strict in 2011; see below), but the city of Chicago does require a permit to own a handgun and have it only in your house, a new law since the SC struck down their handgun ban a couple of years ago. Not sure of anywhere else besides the ones previously named in this thread (MA and NJ). In many states the gun needs to be either locked up or somewhere you can't reach it while operating the vehicle, in Colorado it's legal to have it in a box in the back seat, or even loose in the trunk, for instance. In all cases, I should think unloaded would be the rule (unless you have a CCP which their state recognizes reciprocally - I don't have any idea which states are reciprocal with which, and I'm sure some states don't recognize CCP and thus would not have any reciprocity; more info below).

If it's in a Uhaul truck or trailer, I have to say, I've never heard of police stopping someone driving a Uhaul to search for guns. Does this actually happen?

If Illinois was a problem, you could always take a more southern route and go through Kentucky, or up around Wisconsin into Michigan. I don't think that will be necessary, though. New York is actually more of an issue, in terms of how many geographical options you have when driving to NH, even though Illinois is a bit larger.

By the way, a graphic on wikipedia, courtesy of the website www.gun-nuttery.com, shows the change in concealed carry laws from 1986 to 2011. In that time period, the US went from having,

in 1986 (my paraphrases are my own):

1 unrestricted carry state (VT) (this does not mean there are no places you cannot carry concealed, just that the state does not require a permit in order to carry in normal unrestricted places),

8 shall-issue states, meaning law enforcement must issue a permit to each applicant unless the person is in a category of persons who are legally barred from owning a gun by federal law. These 8 states include 3 New England states: NH, ME and CT,
 
25 may-issue states, meaning law enforcement decides who to give permits to beyond the restrictions of gun ownership under federal law, and

16- no issue states (concealed carry is not allowed except, I assume, by on-duty law enforcement personnel),

gradually changing to where
 
in 2011, the numbers are:
4 unrestricted or constitutional carry states (VT, AK, AZ, and WY),
a staggering 37 shall-issue states, still including NH, ME and CT, and adding PA,
8 may-issue (all other northeastern states make up 6 of these, plus CA and HI), and
only 1 no-issue state, Illinois.

It is great fun to see the colors change to the more liberty-friendly colors over time, with the more controlling yellows and reds vanishing to become blue and green. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concealed_carry_in_the_United_States

Also, the chart below the map slideshow reveals some nuance to this categorization. For instance, 4 states' carry law status is disputed, AL, CT, MD, and NY, with some others that have different category in practice than what the statutes say. Also, the WY unrestricted, i.e. constitutional carry is only for state residents, and MT also has unrestricted carry outside of city limits, though it is listed as a shall-issue state. This kind of diversity of law is very desirable under a federal system since it gives citizens the freedom to choose between competing laws. This change in legal status coincides with a greater movement to have states issuing their own differing laws rather than having the federal government issuing a single standard, at least on some popular issues, and I find it exciting.

The article also states that Utah and Florida concealed carry permits have the widest reciprocity with other states, which is useful for people in VT where you not only don't need a concealed carry permit, you can't even get one because the state doesn't issue them.

This doesn't really answer directly the question about transporting weapons but it is interesting to see the change toward greater gun rights over time, just in the last 25 years (since the presidency of the most rhetorically pro-freedom Republican president in recent history, Reagan - I don't say that he followed those positions very well but I do think his speeches helped get the rank and file of the Republican party back to the principles of the founding fathers to some extent. I especially admire his decision to appoint only judges with an originalist view of the Constitution to federal judgeships - he elevated William Rehnquist and appointed Antonin Scalia based on that principle).
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: 10stateswithnh on September 01, 2012, 04:42:07 am
Never mind about the FOPA, I found it: The Firearms Owner Protection Act. It does say what people were saying about being able to travel through the state legally with your guns. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act)

Nevertheless, according to the article on NY state gun laws, in the section on nonresident travel through New York, "traveling through New York State while possessing any handgun, for any purpose, without a New York State pistol license, is legally risky. New York State law does include a few very limited exceptions for interstate transportation of firearms." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_New_York (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_New_York)

The article didn't state if the FOPA has ever been tested in court. It's possible you would claim this protection only to have the court rule against you.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: 10stateswithnh on September 01, 2012, 05:19:30 am
On this article, you can click on any state's name, which takes you down to a section for the state, then there is another link to another article which provides specifics of the state's gun laws. Very useful resource.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29)
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: 10stateswithnh on September 01, 2012, 05:27:27 am
Also found this on the page about MA: "While Massachusetts' firearms laws are some of the strictest, they are not applicable to travelers who comply with the Firearm Owners Protection Act's traveler's exemption."
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on September 01, 2012, 07:56:40 am
On this article, you can click on any state's name, which takes you down to a section for the state, then there is another link to another article which provides specifics of the state's gun laws. Very useful resource.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_the_United_States_%28by_state%29)

You want to take any gun articles on Wikipedia with a very large grain of salt. Some are spot on, some are ludicrously incorrect, and others fall between the two extremes.

The best (i.e. most accurate) site related to US state gun laws is http://handgunlaw.us (http://).
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Sam Adams on September 01, 2012, 07:08:58 pm
  Its already been thru Mass courts that if you legally own or have a carry govt permission you can pass thru Mass legally with guns. Guns should be in trunk or locked up away from passangers[drivers compartment] unloaded and ammo stored in different area from gun. Nobody can legally search your auto without warrent or your permission unless you have committed a felony, so I don,t know why this matters, so NO to a search and don,t answer any questions
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on September 01, 2012, 09:01:22 pm
Nobody can legally search your auto without warrent or your permission unless you have committed a felony, so I don,t know why this matters, so NO to a search and don,t answer any questions

The cops will just lie and claim they smelled pot coming from the car.  That's now standard operating procedure.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on September 01, 2012, 10:44:18 pm
Nobody can legally search your auto without warrent or your permission unless you have committed a felony, so I don,t know why this matters, so NO to a search and don,t answer any questions

The cops will just lie and claim they smelled pot coming from the car.  That's now standard operating procedure.

Ding.

Anyway, I'll be getting my Utah CHL which has reciprocity with states from OR right up to IL, at which point IL forward to "home" will have everything locked up and stowed in the back of the truck. I'm not sure I can do anything to put the ammo cans "away" from the locked-box rifles and such though....

Also, if it isn't obvious, I'm highly un-trusting to anyone with power hence doing my homework now.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on September 01, 2012, 10:51:11 pm
I'm not sure I can do anything to put the ammo cans "away" from the locked-box rifles and such though....

"Away" typically means, "in a separately-locked container."  In other words, don't lock the guns and ammo in the same box.

If the ammo cans have hasps, padlock them (or run a cable lock through all of the hasps).

Or ship them to your destination.  The rules for shipping ammo are not as complex as the rules for shipping firearms, so lots of folks will just box it up and hand it to UPS...
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on September 01, 2012, 11:24:20 pm
That's not a bad idea. I was thinking of just putting the ammo cans in the trunk of my car, which I'm towing behind the truck anyway.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Sam Adams on September 02, 2012, 09:36:12 am
Nobody can legally search your auto without warrent or your permission unless you have committed a felony, so I don,t know why this matters, so NO to a search and don,t answer any questions

The cops will just lie and claim they smelled pot coming from the car.  That's now standard operating procedure.
                          Thats injustice. Its always good idea to travel with a witness, being alone on the kings highway is asking 4 trouble esp. at night. In the lower states the govt officials are bonded for liability and for lawsuits. Towns are quick to settle 4 20k or 50 k to have lawsuits go away that show unconstitutional injustice upon well inform citizens. Once you supeana[sp] the govt lackeys 10 year history of violations , arrest record and complaints, similar searches and confiscations, and medical and mental history reports, its cheaper to settle.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on September 02, 2012, 09:38:52 am
Thats injustice. Its always good idea to travel with a witness, being alone on the kings highway is asking 4 trouble esp. at night. In the lower states the govt officials are bonded for liability and for lawsuits. Towns are quick to settle 4 20k or 50 k to have lawsuits go away that show unconstitutional injustice upon well inform citizens. Once you supeana[sp] the govt lackeys 10 year history of violations , arrest record and complaints, similar searches and confiscations, and medical and mental history reports, its cheaper to settle.

Good luck with that.  You could have a hundred witnesses, but the judge will take the word of the shadiest cop over all of them, in most cases.

Audio/video evidence is about the only thing that can help.  Hence why they now use claims of smelling things: there's no way to prove what the cop did or did not smell.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on September 02, 2012, 11:52:42 am
Audio/video evidence is about the only thing that can help.  Hence why they now use claims of smelling things: there's no way to prove what the cop did or did not smell.

So basically once I move to NH, I'll start working on an air chromograph that can detect various compounds in the cabin; get a NIST calibration cert and use some SD Flash as a recording medium. Helllloooooo product idea :)

(And this isn't really a joke either)
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Sam Adams on September 02, 2012, 05:22:11 pm
[quote

Good luck with that.  You could have a hundred witnesses, but the judge will take the word of the shadiest cop over all of them, in most cases.

Audio/video evidence is about the only thing that can help.  Hence why they now use claims of smelling things: there's no way to prove what the cop did or did not smell.
[/quote]     This is why we have a Jury system, even though they have to be trained during the trial. Americans are starting to wake up that their dream or country isn,t what it was 10 years ago. Felon and Criminal court charges need corpus delicti[sp]  that injuries[property or body, but the state likes to say they are damaged, but never admit that in open court. Admirality flag is a 4 colored flag having gold yellow band around outside, the court flies it meaning foreign military take-over.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on September 02, 2012, 10:16:24 pm

Admirality flag is a 4 colored flag having gold yellow band around outside, the court flies it meaning foreign military take-over.


Oh, please, not this guff again.  ::)
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: plasma1010 on September 17, 2012, 01:09:21 pm
If you are that worried just sell your firearm and buy a new one in NH. Or don't break any traffic laws on the way. They can't just search your car for no reason (unless you are literally traveling into NYC or over any of the major bridges I would be careful. Stick to remote roads, small towns.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on September 17, 2012, 09:53:06 pm
If you are that worried just sell your firearm and buy a new one in NH. Or don't break any traffic laws on the way. They can't just search your car for no reason (unless you are literally traveling into NYC or over any of the major bridges I would be careful. Stick to remote roads, small towns.

I'm not one for taking needless losses. It'll basically be carry up to IL; then no carry from IL into NY then VT then NH.

And I signed the statement of intent this past saturday.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jerry on October 08, 2012, 11:15:18 am
Nobody can legally search your auto without warrent or your permission unless you have committed a felony, so I don,t know why this matters, so NO to a search and don,t answer any questions

The cops will just lie and claim they smelled pot coming from the car.  That's now standard operating procedure.
 

That doesn't work for the cops in MA anymore.  The MA Supreme Court has ruled that since the possession of less than an ounce is now an infraction and not a crime the smell of pot is not probable cause to search a car.
We need a law like that in NH.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on October 08, 2012, 05:02:32 pm
The cops will just lie and claim they smelled pot coming from the car.  That's now standard operating procedure.
That doesn't work for the cops in MA anymore.  The MA Supreme Court has ruled that since the possession of less than an ounce is now an infraction and not a crime the smell of pot is not probable cause to search a car.

Yeah, but it would work in other states, along the way.

But I expect they'd just come up with some other similarly-ridiculous excuse.

We need a law like that in NH.

Indeed.  That's what folks need to realize, when they talk about laws which will allow the cops excessive discretion.  "Oh, they won't arrest you for that unless you're really a menace."  Yeah, but they can use it as an excuse for a search and other such harassment.  We need to cut down on the possible exuses they can come up with.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 14, 2012, 11:57:17 am
At this point, I've plotted out my trip. Luckily, I can get through IL without making a stop. That should help. The only other point of concern is the NY travel, making stops in Rochester, then Schenectady (SP?) before the ~5 hr drive to "home."
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 14, 2012, 03:39:04 pm
At this point, I've plotted out my trip. Luckily, I can get through IL without making a stop. That should help. The only other point of concern is the NY travel, making stops in Rochester, then Schenectady (SP?) before the ~5 hr drive to "home."

Do you have a particular reason for spending that much time transiting NY? I have this trip many, many times, and my preferred route is I-80 across PA, after which you have a couple of options, both of which minimize NY time.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jerry on October 14, 2012, 03:59:46 pm
At this point, I've plotted out my trip. Luckily, I can get through IL without making a stop. That should help. The only other point of concern is the NY travel, making stops in Rochester, then Schenectady (SP?) before the ~5 hr drive to "home."

Do you have a particular reason for spending that much time transiting NY? I have this trip many, many times, and my preferred route is I-80 across PA, after which you have a couple of options, both of which minimize NY time.

I suggest overnighting in northwest  PA and traveling across NY on Interstate 90.  That keeps you out of the reach of all the crazy NYC cops.
I can make the trip from Erie to Grafton in 10 hours or less.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 14, 2012, 04:14:36 pm
At this point, I've plotted out my trip. Luckily, I can get through IL without making a stop. That should help. The only other point of concern is the NY travel, making stops in Rochester, then Schenectady (SP?) before the ~5 hr drive to "home."

Do you have a particular reason for spending that much time transiting NY? I have this trip many, many times, and my preferred route is I-80 across PA, after which you have a couple of options, both of which minimize NY time.

I suggest overnighting in northwest  PA and traveling across NY on Interstate 90.  That keeps you out of the reach of all the crazy NYC cops.
I can make the trip from Erie to Grafton in 10 hours or less.

NY State Police can be just as crazy. When they roadblock I-90 and start randomly searching cars it takes hours to untangle. I prefer I-80 across PA, then cross the Hudson on either Newburgh-Beacon or Tappan Zee bridges.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 14, 2012, 05:50:38 pm
Is PA actually less insane than NY State? I can go across PA via I-80, head north via I-81, then to I-88, finally onto Highway 7.

But... NYState actually stops interstate traffic??
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jerry on October 14, 2012, 06:29:30 pm
Is PA actually less insane than NY State? I can go across PA via I-80, head north via I-81, then to I-88, finally onto Highway 7.

But... NYState actually stops interstate traffic??

PA is much more sane than NY.  If you got your Utah permit it's reciprocal with PA.  Carry your piece to dinner.

I've been driving I-90 many years and the only blockades I've seen were back in the 60's near Silver Creek, where I-90 crosses the Indian reservation.  The tribe would light piles of tires to stop traffic every time the state tried to tax them.  The Governor would call within a few hours and promise to stop doing whatever if they would just clear the road.

I usually get off I-90 around Amsterdam, head north on 87 then east on 22 to get in to VT as soon as possible.  But I'm headed for Grafton, which part of NH are you aimed at?
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 14, 2012, 06:35:45 pm
Is PA actually less insane than NY State? I can go across PA via I-80, head north via I-81, then to I-88, finally onto Highway 7.

But... NYState actually stops interstate traffic??

It sounds like you're committed to coming in from the West on SR 7. It's a pretty route, but it can be very slow, especially in bad weather. Unless you have some particular reason to take the slower route, I would recommend I-80/84/91 to reach Western NH. For central/East, use I-80/84/90/ then 93 or 95.

Yes, PA is a lot better than NY. And yes, I have seen I-90 entirely blocked in NY while they searched vehicles.

Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 14, 2012, 06:46:25 pm
I'm basically assuming that MA is a war-zone, so I'm trying to create a route which does not pass through it.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 14, 2012, 06:47:04 pm
I usually get off I-90 around Amsterdam, head north on 87 then east on 22 to get in to VT as soon as possible.  But I'm headed for Grafton, which part of NH are you aimed at?

Chester, NH
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jerry on October 14, 2012, 07:12:20 pm
I usually get off I-90 around Amsterdam, head north on 87 then east on 22 to get in to VT as soon as possible.  But I'm headed for Grafton, which part of NH are you aimed at?

Chester, NH

So your map has you entering VT at Bennington and I aim for Rutland.
I find the southern route more challenging in bad weather because of the steep hills.
The northern route seems flatter.
When I checked Google Maps I was surprised that the travel time only varied by 5 minutes.

Will you be getting here before the snow?
Watch out for those 35MPH signs where you'd least expect them.  VT local cops use radar speed traps.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 14, 2012, 07:23:01 pm
So it looks like this: http://tinyurl.com/8gkvtcy

I don't know about the snow, I'm probably going to eat it hard in moving Mid November.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Winston Smith on October 14, 2012, 08:42:28 pm
Don't risk your freedom on this, but I believe the commerce clause prohibits states from restricting/regulating the transportation of firearms THROUGH their state, although if you make any kind of stop within the state in question the entire story changes.  So long as the guns and ammo are locked up seperately and out of reach of occupants, I think you should be okay.  A few other suggestions that may be helpful:

Call the NRA rep for the state in question

Do an FFL transfer of your firearms(Shouldn't be necessary, but guaranteed to keep you legal)

If you are taking multiple vehicles, remove the bolts and bring them in another car, or ship them.(this is similar to AR15's where only the lower receiver is considered a firearm)

Have UPS/FEDEX ship them(UPS Stores will only ship muzzleloaders or guns made before 1898, but if you call they can direct you to a hub capable of shipping firearms)

Whatever you do, make sure you cross the T's, dot the I's, and stay out of the Communist Republic of Massachusetts as much as possible.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 14, 2012, 09:34:34 pm
So it looks like this: http://tinyurl.com/8gkvtcy

I don't know about the snow, I'm probably going to eat it hard in moving Mid November.

As an extreme example of how bad that road can get, it once took me 7 hours to drive from Albany to Keene, going across Vermont in a snowstorm.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 14, 2012, 09:40:33 pm
I'm basically assuming that MA is a war-zone, so I'm trying to create a route which does not pass through it.

Nah, the Mass Turnpike (I-90) is fine. The state troopers there are only concerned with speeding, and they are even loose about that West of I-84. If you go 80/81/84/90/495/93 you will avoid the denser area around Boston and it will bring you right into Manchester.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 15, 2012, 12:17:57 am
Do an FFL transfer of your firearms(Shouldn't be necessary, but guaranteed to keep you legal)

If I did an FFL transfer, I would probably just fly over (still figuring out how to deal with my cat).

I'm not particularly interested in re-running through a NICS check on all my toys though.

As an extreme example of how bad that road can get, it once took me 7 hours to drive from Albany to Keene, going across Vermont in a snowstorm.

Uhg. How much better (if at all) would be via Rutland?

Nah, the Mass Turnpike (I-90) is fine. The state troopers there are only concerned with speeding, and they are even loose about that West of I-84. If you go 80/81/84/90/495/93 you will avoid the denser area around Boston and it will bring you right into Manchester.

It's Mass. Not going to touch it.


Edit: ... given that I'm now at the stage where I'm trying to buy a house and work on moving... do I still count as a prospective mover? XD
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felon
Post by: BDJ on October 15, 2012, 04:29:34 am
But you really don't want to try taking guns into Canada.

That is correct. In Canada they don't even issue permits to off duty officers and you have virtually no right to protection. Only criminals have them in Canada.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: JasonPSorens on October 15, 2012, 09:19:26 am
Mid-November shouldn't be bad for snow. It would have to be a truly freak event to get anything more than a couple of inches, which you wouldn't even notice on the road. January and February are the times of the year you have to watch out for.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 16, 2012, 01:00:54 am

Nah, the Mass Turnpike (I-90) is fine. The state troopers there are only concerned with speeding, and they are even loose about that West of I-84. If you go 80/81/84/90/495/93 you will avoid the denser area around Boston and it will bring you right into Manchester.

It's Mass. Not going to touch it.


Obviously, you have to be comfortable with your route, and I hope that you arrive safely, whatever roads you use.

But if you are under the impression that gun owners transiting NY are in less danger from the state than those transiting MA, you have been grossly misinformed. NY is one of the few places that does not always honor FOPA, where MA generally does.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 16, 2012, 02:04:48 pm
It's more the "bringing a firearm into the state is an automatic felony" in MA that is the paranoia. NY might be equivalently bad as MA, but the codified law really offsets the value :\
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on October 16, 2012, 05:24:42 pm
It's more the "bringing a firearm into the state is an automatic felony" in MA that is the paranoia. NY might be equivalently bad as MA, but the codified law really offsets the value :\

I'm pretty sure that's the case in NY, as well, isn't it?
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 17, 2012, 06:16:58 pm
On the Firearms guide linked from the freestateproject.org front page, it made no mention of NY explicitly disregarding FOPA as MA does.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: KBCraig on October 17, 2012, 06:42:07 pm
On the Firearms guide linked from the freestateproject.org front page, it made no mention of NY explicitly disregarding FOPA as MA does.

It's not official policy anywhere. NJ and NYC (as opposed to NYS) are the two locations that seem devoted to ignoring it.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: MaineShark on October 17, 2012, 06:43:12 pm
On the Firearms guide linked from the freestateproject.org front page, it made no mention of NY explicitly disregarding FOPA as MA does.

Can you link to the actual guide you're reading?  I don't see one that matches that.

In any case, both NY and Mass have strongly-anti-gun governments.  In a number of ways, NY is actually worse than Mass.  It's actually possible for a non-resident to get a Mass license to carry, even if it's a hassle, and by no means certain that they will decide to issue one.  NY does not issue non-resident licenses, at all (there's no provision for such a thing, within their laws).
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 18, 2012, 12:13:18 am
Sure: http://www.pgnh.org/gunlawfaqs

The specific quote is:
"Q: What if I want to visit Massachusetts?

A:  WARNING – WARNING – WARNING!  Unless you have a Massachusetts non-resident License to Carry, bringing a firearm into Massachusetts is a FELONY, with minimum mandatory imprisonment of 18 months!  And, believe it or not, bringing an EMPTY SHELL CASING — which Massachusetts considers an “ammunition component” — can also get you jailed, in this case for up to two years."

And in re-reading this, the response is contingent upon "visiting" not passing through... so ... I'm wrong. I read the "bringing a firearm into Mass is a FELONY" and that threw a flag. So I guess I just need to UPS my ammo?

Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 18, 2012, 02:28:33 am
It's more the "bringing a firearm into the state is an automatic felony" in MA that is the paranoia. NY might be equivalently bad as MA, but the codified law really offsets the value :\

That is for unlicensed non-residents who enter Mass on a casual "visit." It doesn't refer to transiting the state under FOPA. MA generally honors the federal law. NY sometimes does not. For that matter, it's also a felony for unlicensed non-residents to bring a handgun and some other types of firearms into NY, and NY does not issue non-resident licenses.

For MA gun laws, I would rely on the GOAL (Gun Owners Action League) website. They address FOPA about 3/4 of the way down the page.

http://goal.org/masslawpages/travelinfo.html
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FrugalFannie on October 18, 2012, 07:15:13 am
In reading up on gun laws from the front page, I learned that if my weapons were in the u-haul and I went through MA to get to NH, I could get busted seriously with multiple felony counts for breeching some stupid law of theirs by just transporting lawfully owned firearms across the border (even in their cases, locked). Learning of this, in spite of the FOPA, are there any other states which are similarly Tyrannical that I have to avoid on the way over from Oregon?

MA gun laws are terrible but not quite as bad as you may think. You do need to follow FOPA rules when traveling through MA with firearms and it's best if you do not get stopped for anything. But if you do, do not consent to search. We are not a 'must inform' state so you would be under no obligation to tell anyone you are transporting firearms. I would rather stop for the night in MA then NY, for sure!
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 18, 2012, 01:23:25 pm
So does this route look better? http://tinyurl.com/9bhl8mt

It drops 30 miles off of the count, and has me only briefly in NY compared to prior duration.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 18, 2012, 02:11:19 pm
So does this route look better? http://tinyurl.com/9bhl8mt

It drops 30 miles off of the count, and has me only briefly in NY compared to prior duration.

That is almost exactly one of the routes I prefer.

My only suggestion would be to think twice about using I-290 to go between I-90 and I-495. Yes, it will save you a small amount of tolls (I-90 is the Massachusetts Turnpike, a toll road), but as you can tell from the route number, it runs right through a city - Worcester, in this case. The lanes gets both slower and narrower there, and sections are usually under construction. I would suggest that you make the decision at the time based on traffic load and how you are feeling.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: JonM on October 18, 2012, 05:22:10 pm
I-290 is somewhat time dependent, you do NOT want to be going through there during any sort of commuter hours.

Have you considered getting an E-ZPass?  http://e-zpassiag.com/about-e-zpass/where-can-i-use-it

Once you hit Illinois you'll be within the E-ZPass network, and being able to go through the tolls without having to wait to pay cash might save you a good bit of time.  Some states have open road tolling, meaning your transponder can be charged while you are going highway speed under a gantry with the tolling equipment, and not have to move off the main road to a toll plaza, as you would if you were paying cash.  Some states even give out of state transponders a discount on the tolls, you'd save $5.25 while going through Ohio if you were on their turnpike from west to east.

https://www.ezpassnh.com/en/home/index.shtml  The transponders cost $8.90 in NH, but they charge a bit more and put the extra $ on it as pre-paid tolls.  You can apply online, and they should mail one to you.  If you link it to a credit card you don't have to worry about having enough pre-paid tolls for the trip.

The downside for the privacy conscious is a record of your trip in each state, but then they might be keeping a record of ya if you go through the cash lane anyway.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 18, 2012, 06:41:37 pm
I'll need the EZPass for I93 commuting anyway, won't I?
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Auspicious Aspect on October 18, 2012, 07:04:13 pm
I'll need the EZPass for I93 commuting anyway, won't I?

No one wanting to maximize freedom in their lives would use the EZPass company's services.

You can still use NH toll roads without it.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: JonM on October 18, 2012, 08:45:08 pm
Currently there is a 30% discount for NH based E-ZPasses on NH tolls.  There is talk about a commuter discount program that would cap the total # of tolls you'd have to pay in a month. Time will tell if that gets implemented.  The bill this session didn't go anywhere.

You'd want an E-ZPass if you were going up I-93 to Concord.  They're currently working on installing open road tolling at the Hooksett plaza, so by next summer those with an E-ZPass will be able to go through at highway speed.  There is currently ORT on the I-95 tolls in NH as well.  This severely reduces the delay to get to the delay at the Maine tolls.

There may at some point in the future be an anonymous E-ZPass transponder you'd be able to buy for cash and reload with cash.  The only downside to such anonymity is if your transponder does not get read (they do claim 99.99%, but I've had my E-ZPass not read a few times, and I don't use it that often), then you'd get a toll violation.  Currently the violation is the price of the toll plus $1 administration fee, so long as you pay it in 30 days.  If you have a normal E-ZPass, you register your car's plates to it, so if the transponder does not get read, they match your plate to your account and debit that rather than giving you a violation.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: JonM on October 19, 2012, 07:53:13 am
I'll need the EZPass for I93 commuting anyway, won't I?

No one wanting to maximize freedom in their lives would use the EZPass company's services.

You can still use NH toll roads without it.
Peering into the future, as more alternative vehicles take to the roads, and the more gas mileage improves, the amount of money collected by the road toll (gas tax) will fall even further short of what is needed to maintain and improve the roads.  The answer may be registration surcharges (does not take use into account), an expansion of the turnpike (user fee) system, as 3 states are currently converting interstates into toll roads, or very invasive GPS units in your car that tells the authorities which states you drove in so they can assess you a fee and apportion it to where you used your vehicle.  I prefer the turnpike in that instance. 

Of course, there may be other answers, perhaps Solar Roadways (http://solarroadways.com/main.html) will actually successfully build glass roads, figure out how to inductively charge an electric vehicle going 70 miles an hour, and change the world.  Perhaps.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jack Nelson on October 19, 2012, 09:33:20 am
You could not have done a better job advancing the agenda of the gun-ban people.

I hope you're proud of the damage you've done.

2,000-plus people have read your eye-catching headline and have this marvelous seed planted in their mind, that exercising their 2nd Amendment rights is going to net them a world of trouble.

How would you propose to begin to undo that damage?
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 19, 2012, 11:41:16 am
You could not have done a better job advancing the agenda of the gun-ban people. I hope you're proud of the damage you've done.

2,000-plus people have read your eye-catching headline and have this marvelous seed planted in their mind, that exercising their 2nd Amendment rights is going to net them a world of trouble.
How would you propose to begin to undo that damage.

If 2,000 people are reading this headline, then that is showing 2000 people that this fire-arm owner is trying to be responsible enough to deal with possible problems involved in a move by asking questions. There is nothing more important to fight against the anti-gun crowd than showing that fire-arm owners can be, and are, responsible with their weapons.

Your claim is outright nonsense, and I would challenge you to provide an evidence based argument to back up your claim. You are otherwise welcome to dismiss yourself from this thread.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: Jerry on October 19, 2012, 01:00:13 pm
You could not have done a better job advancing the agenda of the gun-ban people.

I hope you're proud of the damage you've done.

2,000-plus people have read your eye-catching headline and have this marvelous seed planted in their mind, that exercising their 2nd Amendment rights is going to net them a world of trouble.

How would you propose to begin to undo that damage?


Say what?
This is the Free State Project forum.  
Anyone reading here already KNOWS that exercising your second amendment rights will get you in trouble.
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: FormulaXFD on October 19, 2012, 08:43:43 pm
My job offer came through. I'm moving Thanksgiving week :)
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: time4liberty on October 22, 2012, 12:23:55 pm
My job offer came through. I'm moving Thanksgiving week :)

Hooray! :)
Title: Re: From OR to NH, any other states like MA that make transit w/firearms a felony?
Post by: crossonscout on October 23, 2012, 01:09:59 pm
My job offer came through. I'm moving Thanksgiving week :)

Yay! Welcome to New England (soon)... you'll love it here. :-)