Free State Project Forum

FSP -- General Discussion => General FSP Discussion => Topic started by: sj on June 26, 2011, 06:26:43 pm

Title: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: sj on June 26, 2011, 06:26:43 pm
First, I'd like to thank Curtis for the hours he put into making this year's PF a success as the head organizer.  Having said that, the event next year should be headed up by someone different, at least until Curtis learns some tact, courtesy, and empathy.

As we were crowding on the hillside for the group photo, Curtis pointed out that that the photo would be taken at 4:20.  He then pointed out a certain group of people on one side of the hill and suggested people should "blow the smoke that way."  When 4:20 rolled around, he gave the classic 4:20 "smoke 'em if you got 'em" through the bullhorn, and a few people did.  There were various families with children sitting on the hill who were there ostensibly to have the group photo taken.  While they weren't stopped from leaving, we were packed in pretty tight and it would have been difficult to leave, though I know of at least one family who did.  So, without any warning, Curtis basically took a captive audience and made sure that those people - and their young children - were subjected to marijuana smoke, whether they wanted to be or not.  This would have been one thing had the event been a marijuana event and people were expecting that, but this is an event where every attendee of porcfest is encouraged to attend, and marijuana wasn't mentioned.

Curtis obviously lacks the maturity at this point to run an event with a wide range of people.  Until this changes, the FSP needs a different organizer for next year.  
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on June 26, 2011, 07:25:08 pm
I hear tell that some of the folks there had body odor (unsurprising after a week of camping), and families with young children were subjected to it.  The horror!

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: sj on June 26, 2011, 07:58:53 pm
I hear tell that some of the folks there had body odor (unsurprising after a week of camping), and families with young children were subjected to it.  The horror!

It's true, and if Curtis had encouraged people to rub their armpits in people's faces, my suggestion would be the same.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on June 26, 2011, 08:28:57 pm
I hear tell that some of the folks there had body odor (unsurprising after a week of camping), and families with young children were subjected to it.  The horror!
It's true, and if Curtis had encouraged people to rub their armpits in people's faces, my suggestion would be the same.

Someone shoved a joint or pipe in someone else's face?  And Curtis asked them to do that?

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: dalebert on June 27, 2011, 07:07:49 am
I agree that it was completely inappropriate to turn the FSP photo into a 420 event, but...

were you one of the people wearing an NBC shirt?  I'm asking because I honestly don't know if you were.  I saw a cluster of people wearing matching t-shirts off in a corner and only heard what the shirts said later.  Bunch of collectivists working very hard to distance themselves from the rest of the bigger-than-ever crowd there and prostrate themselves to the mainstream peanut gallery in a very divisive and insulting manner.  Curtis should have found a more tactful way to make fun of them.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: FTL_Ian on June 27, 2011, 07:38:23 am
I think Jason Osborne should be the new organizer, but regarding this particular critique of Curtis, it seemed to me that he was simply acknowledging what was going to happen at 4:20 regardless.

I think parents need to grow the fuck up and have an honest conversation with their kids about pot, instead of expecting the rest of the world to coddle their children in some fantasy land where no such things exist.

Same thing with nudity.  I heard some parent(s) complained cause a woman was walking around wearing pasties on her nipples.

Porcfest is a family event, but only if the parents are running a family that is mature enough to actually have conversations with their kids rather than cowardly avoiding mature issues.

Grow up or get lost.  People smoke pot.  People get naked.  Whoop-de-doo.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: rossby on June 27, 2011, 11:03:48 am
I think parents need to grow the fuck up and have an honest conversation with their kids about pot, instead of expecting the rest of the world to coddle their children in some fantasy land where no such things exist.

Same thing with nudity.  I heard some parent(s) complained cause a woman was walking around wearing pasties on her nipples.

Porcfest is a family event, but only if the parents are running a family that is mature enough to actually have conversations with their kids rather than cowardly avoiding mature issues.

Grow up or get lost.  People smoke pot.  People get naked.  Whoop-de-doo.

La la la... he said nothing about that.

He said that the PorcFest photo was turned into a 420 event, and that the FSP's representative directed one group of people to be very disrespectful to another group of people.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: sandm000 on June 27, 2011, 11:55:58 am
I agree that it was completely inappropriate to turn the FSP photo into a 420 event, but...

were you one of the people wearing an NBC shirt?  I'm asking because I honestly don't know if you were.  I saw a cluster of people wearing matching t-shirts off in a corner and only heard what the shirts said later.  Bunch of collectivists working very hard to distance themselves from the rest of the bigger-than-ever crowd there and prostrate themselves to the mainstream peanut gallery in a very divisive and insulting manner.  Curtis should have found a more tactful way to make fun of them.

Dale, I was wearing an NBC shirt on the hill. I had my 3 sons on the hill with me (they're 4,3, and 2) I think Curtis' joke was appropriate and well timed. I think the delay until 4:20 was a bit of a pain as everybody was in each others space. I also didn't smell anything, so I was not at all offended by the acts of those lighting up to celebrate. But all of those pot smokers (who I assume were at the upper left of the photo) were doing the same thing you accuse the t-shirt wearers of doing, all of their defiant acts of individuality just happened to spontaneously coincide, whereas ours was planned in advance.


I think Jason Osborne should be the new organizer, but regarding this particular critique of Curtis, it seemed to me that he was simply acknowledging what was going to happen at 4:20 regardless.

I think parents need to grow the fuck up and have an honest conversation with their kids about pot, instead of expecting the rest of the world to coddle their children in some fantasy land where no such things exist.

Same thing with nudity.  I heard some parent(s) complained cause a woman was walking around wearing pasties on her nipples.

Porcfest is a family event, but only if the parents are running a family that is mature enough to actually have conversations with their kids rather than cowardly avoiding mature issues.

Grow up or get lost.  People smoke pot.  People get naked.  Whoop-de-doo.

I think there's something else going on here, maybe another thread of "Oh god, what are THOSE people doing?" on another forum?
There was definitely nudity up by my site, because at least one of my kids had taken off his pants and run to the playground.
I went down to Fixx Brewing and the group of guys across the way decided to light up and when they saw me and my kids they voluntarily said "We'll move this to the back side" and they walked the six feet to keep smoke away. That was very mature of them, I didn't ask them to. I figured that my kids at ground level probably weren't going to get damaged by the minuscule amount of smoke in the air.However when another group busted out a tray of glass pipes, I didn't complain to the people on the campsite, I walked my kids up to the playground.

I honestly don't know where your complaints are coming from. If you could direct me to the locations where people are voicing these opinions I'll back you up.

But could you address the original main point of the OP? Was Curtis a good Tsar? Or should he be replaced? He should have a lot of notes about how things could be better next year. You'll lose some of that if you replace him. Although I've heard a couple critiques of his management style, I don't know how much would be required before you would consider replacing him.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: LoveFreedomAndLiberty on June 27, 2011, 11:56:09 am
First, let me say:

1) I did not attend Porcfest

2) I do not have children

3) I am new here and don't know anyone so therefore am not taking sides

After reading the above comments, I just wanted to volunteer my humble opinions.

The thing about people, we are all similar, yet different.  I believe every human being has the right to choice and free will.

Some people are regularly drug tested in their line of work (even if the individual personally supports the decriminalization of all drugs).  So, that individual might choose to distance themselves from those smoking pot to avoid any contact with it.  Also, maybe some people just don't like the smell of smoke in general,  and have gotten up and walked away from an area with cigarette smokers.  I also have excused myself from an intoxicated person (I wanted to avoid vomit, and what was funny to a drunk person was not funny to a sober person).  People have excused themselves from me when I had too much to drink, and I didn't take it personal.  So, perhaps a person isn't in denial, or in a fantasy, maybe they are just exercising their freedom of choice.

Also, if I had children, I don't want anyone raising my kids for me.  I want to decide at what age my child learns about death, war, pot, religion, nudity, pornography, etc.  As an adult, I don't care to see people walking around naked, near naked, etc.  So, I might excuse myself politely from that situation.  If I want to look at naked people I will join a nudist colony. Since the U.S. is supposed to be the fattest  country on earth, why do we want to run around naked?  However, I support everyone's right to do so. Maybe a parent doesn't want to answer at this exact moment why there are different shapes, sizes, and who knows what other questions the kid is going to have.  Maybe I want to teach my child to see beyond the breasts into what is really important, but others must allow me to choose what and when I teach my child, just as they choose in their own lives.  Just because I don't show my kid porn movies (example) doesn't mean I deny they exist, nor do I expect others to deny they exist.  However, I want my child to learn these things from me so they can learn my feelings and then form their own.    

Excusing myself from a situation is my choice just as it is another's choice to walk around naked, near naked, etc.  I think we all have a right to live peaceful and happy, but sometimes we just have to agree to disagree. That doesn't mean we can't be good neighbors to one another.  Afterall, we all want freedom and less interference in our lives, right?  Personally, I wouldn't want the mosquito bites of being almost naked in the woods.

My suggestion is that this is an opportunity.  An opportunity to improve Porcfest even further.  Since Porcfest has a goal of making every Liberty Lover welcome, without discrimination, consider making an "Over 21" area where nudity, drink, etc. can be done openly and everyone is informed.  If a parent chooses to bring their 5 year old to that area, fine.  What is appropriate for one child's maturity level might not be appropriate for another child of the same age. Just make it clear that adult activities are in progress in this area.  Then, have an "All ages" area that a parent can turn their kids loose and not worry if they will have to have the sex talk with a child they feel is to young to have that conversation with.  Just as I don't want my hypothetical kid learning the "f" word from their uncle because then that is the only word they want to use....the one I ask them to stop saying (because it pops out at the worst times).  

Some parents allow their child to have a glass of wine/alcohol with dinner, while other parents do not allow alcohol until a certain age, and others don't allow it at all.  I support the parent's right to choice and right to parent.

What works for one person, doesn't for the next.  What is fun for one person is boring to the next.  So, why not show support for freedom of choice by providing choice?  Make family friendly areas (just like the quiet zones).  Then make "anything goes" zones.  Isn't there an "Under 21" category on this message board.... why not extend that to Porcfest?  People have already been praised above for their hard work in organizing, so that doesn't seem to be the issue.  Instead it seems there is now an opportunity for Porcfest to grow and expand again, offering freedom lovers more choices in the future.  

I don't deny pot, nudity, or anything else in society exists.  However, I do ask people to respect my choice not to partake the same way I respect their right to partake.  Just because we don't have ALL of the same interests doesn't mean I want to stop others from their pursuit of happiness, nor do I wish to be judged or stopped on my choices in my pursuit of happiness.  While we might share opinions on some topics, some people might be very liberal, some people extremely conservative, and others are middle of the road.  We all have a right to free will and to choose how we are comfortable living.  We must respect another's opinions and choices, even if we disagree with them, if we want others to respect our choices and right to choice.

Anyway, just thought I would toss a neutral, friendly opinion in the discussion.  

Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: lobstah on June 27, 2011, 01:02:04 pm
i think i'll have to agree with ian on this point...sort of. while i do have two small children, i flew solo at porcfest this time. had they been there, would i have minded the pot smoke? no, i don't think so. i think that a big part of freedom is learning to get used to the fact the your neighbors might engage in activities in which you yourself do not engage (such as smoking weed). kids are going to find out what cannabis is eventually anyway, so what's the harm? if there were any individuals who were actually blowing smoking in children's faces, then shame on them....but i doubt that that was actually going on. i enjoyed the open cannabis use at porcfest, but was careful to not be so open about it that i would be bothering anyone. another part of freedom is respecting those around you. if you are a parent, and you feel someone is being rude about his or her pot smoking (by doing it too close to your children or whatever), then SAY SOMETHING TO THAT PERSON...or, if you prefer, just walk away.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: dalebert on June 27, 2011, 01:21:37 pm
But all of those pot smokers (who I assume were at the upper left of the photo) were doing the same thing you accuse the t-shirt wearers of doing, all of their defiant acts of individuality just happened to spontaneously coincide, whereas ours was planned in advance.

Wearing shirts labeling yourself "normal" by comparison to certain others who are by implication "not normal" is an act of defiance?  4 realz?  Ooooooooookay.  Seems like an act of trying to fit into and appeal to the mainstream which is kind of like the opposite of an act of defiance.

Anyways, the shirt is actually kind of funny just as an inside joke between those of us who realize there is such a variety of personalities within the FSP.  I already feel I have over-reacted.  Some people were offended by it but maybe they (and I for a little while) are just reading a little too much into it.  That said, I'm still going to make fun of you guys tonight on FTL.  The ribbing is all in good fun.

I don't really feel qualified to judge Curtis' performance beyond this incident.  I have heard hearsay about scheduling problems and such.  (I did just check and noticed that Prometheus Unchained and Corey Moore's VORD in the media room Saturday afternoon never did make it to the online schedule.)  My overall experience of Porcfest was positive but I feel like it would take work to screw up what is largely so good because it forms organically from lots of different folks doing their own things.  I will say that it was a little like a movie that's really good all the way through and then kind of ends on a whimper since apparently nothing happened Sunday when I'm so used to a nice cap off.  When you've had a wonderful week, it's nice to stick around and bask in the afterglow and hear the numbers, the excitement about next year's PF, news about Liberty Forum, etc.  That did feel like a pretty glaring hole in my expected experience at PF but I don't know who's responsible for that.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: dalebert on June 27, 2011, 01:29:08 pm
You know, I stopped being offended about the t-shirts.  My initial reaction was WTF!?  But then I realized it was prolly just playful ribbing from the more conservative types toward the more libertine types and it's just kind of funny.  And then I thought back to Curtis' comment and realized it felt very much the same way.  People WERE smoking pot, outdoors, with plenty of fresh air, and the idea of blowing smoke ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE CROWD toward the t-shirt group is pretty obviously just playful ribbing and an empty threat.  Even a comment about 420 is going to be either lost on kids completely or if it isn't, they're learning nothing new because they already get it.

This is much ado about nothing.

Now whether he effed up PF, and if so, how much, remains to be discussed.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: djbridgeland on June 27, 2011, 01:32:17 pm
I do think that Porcfest does need another organizer for 2012, however for several different reasons.  I had heard from several vendors and event organizers that the ball had been dropped on organizing their events and supplies / advertisements where not delivered in a timely fashion that a serious last minute stains where placed on the vendors and event organizers.  Closing ceremonies, did they happen?  Not that I'm big on events however the fact that lots come from out of state and that is an investment for them. As this has historically been a good session on the progress of the FSP epically for those from out of state and /or considering the FSP.          
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Friday on June 27, 2011, 08:07:19 pm
People WERE smoking pot, outdoors, with plenty of fresh air, and the idea of blowing smoke ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE CROWD toward the t-shirt group is pretty obviously just playful ribbing and an empty threat. 
That was how I took it.  I thought it was a joke.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Floridian on June 28, 2011, 05:35:39 am
I was there with my children.  It was funny the first time when Curtis said that the photo would be at 4:20 and everyone got it.  When he continued to press the 4:20 theme it got old.  I consider him guilty of bad and perhaps inappropriate humor given the situation.

No harm, no foul.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dreepa on June 28, 2011, 07:38:50 am
 I will say that it was a little like a movie that's really good all the way through and then kind of ends on a whimper since apparently nothing happened Sunday when I'm so used to a nice cap off.  

You mean 'Happy Ending'?
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: LoveFreedomAndLiberty on June 28, 2011, 01:57:49 pm
If an individual wants to volunteer to assist at Porcfest 2012, wherever they are needed, who should they contact?

Where should individuals submit ideas and feedback about Porcfest?  

Should interested persons do the above on this thread or should we start a new one?
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dreepa on June 28, 2011, 03:06:30 pm
My suggestion would be to write it all down... and then in about a month ask.....

(the organizers of PF11  will need to take moments to breathe... and if they get emails now... they might get lost in the shuffle)
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on June 29, 2011, 08:52:18 am
Afaik very few people lit up, and those that did were going to anyway. The 4:20pm photo time was chosen not to coincide with pot smoking, but to give those who were working (JJ, the bands, etc) a concrete time to show up and get in the photo, while still giving us (the other people who were actually working) time to get everyone else down there. The NBC shirts (Normal By Comparison) elicited the 420 comment(s). Maybe the joke was in poor taste, old, or could have been better, but I dare everyone of YOU to try organizing a festival for 52 weeks, 20-80 hours a week, then run said festival with MINIMAL assistance, and still be funny the last day.

PS whoever the lady is that came up to me during the family carnival to berate me about the group photo POSSIBLY 'competing' (I designed the schedule so NOTHING would compete with the group photo. That is the ONLY 'event' I scheduled that way) who I've NEVER MET BEFORE, and who has NEVER SPOKEN TO ME... Oh geez I got nothing nice to say about her...
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: FTL_Ian on June 29, 2011, 09:27:44 am
Actually, I think the Osbornes should organize Porcfest.  He seemed to think he could do it better, and I'd like to see him try it.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: sandm000 on June 29, 2011, 10:20:09 am
Btw afaik very few people lit up, and those that did were going to anyway. The 4:20pm photo time was chosen not to coincide with pot smoking, but to give those who were working (JJ, the bands, etc) a concrete time to show up and get in the photo, while still giving us (the other people who were actually working) time to get everyone else down there. The NBC shirts (Normal By Comparison) elicited the 420 comment(s). Maybe the joke was in poor taste, old, or could have been better, but I dare everyone of YOU to try organizing a festival for 52 weeks, 20-80 hours a week, then run said festival with MINIMAL assistance, and still be funny the last day.

PS whoever the lady is that came up to me during the family carnival to berate me about the group photo POSSIBLY 'competing' (I designed the schedule so NOTHING would compete with the group photo. That is the ONLY 'event' I scheduled that way) who I've NEVER MET BEFORE, and who has NEVER SPOKEN TO ME... Oh geez I got nothing nice to say about her...

I had no problem with people lighting up, or being singled out as NBC to have smoke blown in my direction. It was a joke, and I saw it as such. The reason it wasn't funny is this: The group photo was scheduled for 4:00, and we were "held" until 4:20. I get that you were trying to organize so that everyone could be in the picture. I didn't want to wait 20 minutes for it (and from the chanting, neither did the other people on the hill), if you had put down 4:10 as the photo time, I think it would have gone over better. But at this point, we're picking nits. None of the problems ruined my PF experience. I moved 4 years ago, I don't need to be convinced to move, so I'm probably not looking at it from the same perspective as the out of staters.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dave Mincin on June 29, 2011, 10:30:23 am
Actually, I think the Osbornes should organize Porcfest.  He seemed to think he could do it better, and I'd like to see him try it.

No disrespect intended to Curtis, and the folks who did a wonderful job organizing this years PorcFest, but I believe a new organizer for next year would be a good idea.  Given the time and effort involved it is really to much to ask one person to do it over and over.  Actually until the past 2 years, we always had a new person take the mantel each year.  New ideas, new perspective, and sharing the burden seems to  be a good idea.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: FTL_Ian on June 29, 2011, 11:09:28 am
Curtis should probably be hired by Osborne to promote Porcfest 2012. 

I also agree with Dave - Carla had a great time this year due to not having the responsibility of organizing the event.  Now Curtis can have the burden lifted as well.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: dalebert on June 29, 2011, 11:12:47 am
The group photo was scheduled for 4:00, and we were "held" until 4:20. I get that you were trying to organize so that everyone could be in the picture. I didn't want to wait 20 minutes for it (and from the chanting, neither did the other people on the hill), if you had put down 4:10 as the photo time, I think it would have gone over better.

I got the impression that was a joke too and not really a 420 thing.  Seems like the photo always takes longer than people would like so we can fill it up with as many people as possible including some folks who find out about it last minute.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: LoveFreedomAndLiberty on June 29, 2011, 01:40:01 pm
52 weeks 20-80 hours per week!!!!!  Is this in addition to a job?  Is Porcfest 100% volunteer or does anyone get paid?  Good grief, with those kinds of hours and dedication I vote that at a minimum anyone that does all that work gets at least a porcupine trophy as an award for being a top volunteer.

Speaking of Porcfest, where can people donate to Porcfest 2012 (financially)?  Where can people sign up to volunteer for a certain amount of hours in 2012 or something ( it seems like a tall order for 1 or a few people to cover it all).
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dreepa on June 29, 2011, 02:17:19 pm
The group photo was scheduled for 4:00, and we were "held" until 4:20. I get that you were trying to organize so that everyone could be in the picture. I didn't want to wait 20 minutes for it (and from the chanting, neither did the other people on the hill), if you had put down 4:10 as the photo time, I think it would have gone over better.

I got the impression that was a joke too and not really a 420 thing.  Seems like the photo always takes longer than people would like so we can fill it up with as many people as possible including some folks who find out about it last minute.


I am 99.999% sure that dale has hit it here.

NBC.. proud as a peacock.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: ny2nh on June 29, 2011, 09:20:30 pm
NBC.. proud as a peacock.

 :o
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 29, 2011, 09:37:26 pm
For those that didn't witness it over the last year ..... yes I would say that Curtis worked on it many hours each week.
I am sure he made plenty of mistakes, but one photo shoot gone bad shouldn't ruin the whole week.
Every year people will complain about how porcfest is run. There are lots of ways to deal with it that are more pleasant than calling for Curtis' head.
But then Curtis is funny looking and wears those creepy fed sunglasses .... so let the tomatoes fly. >:D
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on June 30, 2011, 07:23:20 am
52 weeks 20-80 hours per week!!!!!  Is this in addition to a job?  Is Porcfest 100% volunteer or does anyone get paid?  Good grief, with those kinds of hours and dedication I vote that at a minimum anyone that does all that work gets at least a porcupine trophy as an award for being a top volunteer.

Speaking of Porcfest, where can people donate to Porcfest 2012 (financially)?  Where can people sign up to volunteer for a certain amount of hours in 2012 or something ( it seems like a tall order for 1 or a few people to cover it all).

Some folks got paid, but not me. Its mostly a volunteer event, and those who got paid were actually compensated below or at their cost of operating.


You can donate to PorcFest 2012 by paypaling your donation to info@freestateproject.org with the note "PF12$"
A new donation widget will be put up on PorcFest.com, soon.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Russell Kanning on June 30, 2011, 01:44:37 pm
not only does he help make porcfest 2011 happen
he is already talking next year
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on June 30, 2011, 11:15:31 pm
not only does he help make porcfest 2011 happen
he is already talking next year

Regardless of how it plays out next year, I'm still the guy with all the knowledge this year, so I reply.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Argentum on July 01, 2011, 06:39:32 am
I think Jason Osborne should be the new organizer, but regarding this particular critique of Curtis, it seemed to me that he was simply acknowledging what was going to happen at 4:20 regardless.

I think parents need to grow the fuck up and have an honest conversation with their kids about pot, instead of expecting the rest of the world to coddle their children in some fantasy land where no such things exist.

Same thing with nudity.  I heard some parent(s) complained cause a woman was walking around wearing pasties on her nipples.

Porcfest is a family event, but only if the parents are running a family that is mature enough to actually have conversations with their kids rather than cowardly avoiding mature issues.

Grow up or get lost.  People smoke pot.  People get naked.  Whoop-de-doo.

Thanks for the parenting advice.  This coming from a guy who doesn't have children and doesn't want children. 
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 01, 2011, 07:34:51 am
I think Jason Osborne should be the new organizer, but regarding this particular critique of Curtis, it seemed to me that he was simply acknowledging what was going to happen at 4:20 regardless.

I think parents need to grow the fuck up and have an honest conversation with their kids about pot, instead of expecting the rest of the world to coddle their children in some fantasy land where no such things exist.

Same thing with nudity.  I heard some parent(s) complained cause a woman was walking around wearing pasties on her nipples.

Porcfest is a family event, but only if the parents are running a family that is mature enough to actually have conversations with their kids rather than cowardly avoiding mature issues.

Grow up or get lost.  People smoke pot.  People get naked.  Whoop-de-doo.
Thanks for the parenting advice.  This coming from a guy who doesn't have children and doesn't want children.

As a parent, I agree with Ian.  Happy, now?

Children who are sheltered and never exposed to the real world are overwhelmingly likely have trouble adjusting (potentially serious trouble; children who are given "abstinence only" sex ed, are statistically likely to wait to have sex until they move out of their parents' house, but are statistically less likely to use protection, thereby ending up with STI's and unwanted pregnancies).  Raising children in some manufactured fantasy-land is bad parenting.

"Now, Johnny, you sit in the corner while we shoot up and have an orgy" is also bad parenting.

From the sounds of things, nothing happened in public at PorcFest that would be on that level, though.  Or even anything close to it.  So any complaints fall under folks trying to artificially shelter their children, which is nothing but a disservice to the children.  Yeah, it made some parents uncomfortable, but parenting isn't about the parents' comfort; parenting is about raising healthy children who are well-adjusted and able to handle life in the real world.  Good parents put their children's needs first, before their own comfort.

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: artienewport on July 01, 2011, 07:42:08 am
Curtis has had enough of a power trip for 2 years, it's time to find someone else.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on July 01, 2011, 08:22:40 am
Curtis has had enough of a power trip for 2 years, it's time to find someone else.

I'm sorry, who are you?
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: micheleseven on July 01, 2011, 10:54:18 am
I am so impressed with the restraint and diplomacy exercised by people right now. I am definitely taking notes as it is often not my strong suit.

Claiming that something takes 20-80 hours a week and is therefore deserving of recognition is not consistent with a merit-based, anarcho-capitalist viewpoint. Imagine if that much effort was put forth to simply be self-supporting!

Although I did not attend this last year, many of those whom I respect in the community who are doers and self-supporting did attend and they are all unhappy with the organizer's results (despite his efforts) and his egocentric attitude. He does seem to be effective at promoting however. Promoting what? is an important question to be asked and I think that you will be surprised at the answer, assuming is it answered honestly.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: robin.freiheit on July 01, 2011, 02:47:04 pm
If there are complaints/criticisms about anything any of the organizers did to make people unhappy, we did have a debrief at the end of porcfest and I am sad that I did not see more folks attend to air their grievances.

That being said, other than the MINOR complaints I have heard from a handful of people... I have heard MANY MANY people tell me it was the best porcfest they have EVER been to, Curtis, you did a great job and I know how hard it was to do all of this work with very little cooperation from other people who wanted to be involved. Props to you, I am glad to have been on your team this year!

Relaying all this "negativity" you heard from other people is unnecessary because you were not there and if they were that concerned it would be best for them to approach the person/people who they were unhappy with to discuss it first. There is no room for growth and improvement when no one is willing to come up to you and say "damn, you did that wrong"... when you hear it through the grape vine it just becomes gossip.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 01, 2011, 02:58:08 pm
That being said, other than the MINOR complaints I have heard from a handful of people... I have heard MANY MANY people tell me it was the best porcfest they have EVER been to

That's what I'm hearing from pretty much everyone.  I haven't heard any serious negative comments from anyone, other than those who virtually only have negativity to offer.  I've made it to roughly every other PorcFest.  While I don't like missing any of them, this is the first one where I really feel I seriously missed out by not being able to attend.

The only meaningful complaint that I seem to hear, is that Curtis is somewhat lacking in tact.  I don't consider that a fault, when it comes to someone interacting with me (I prefer blunt honesty), but others do seem to have an issue with it.  Maybe we can have an ambassador, next year?

Actually, since it sounds like Curtis isn't happy with the lack of help, maybe we need to go to having more than one organizer?  Maybe get two or three individuals to team up, so no one individual has to bear all the weight, and (hopefully) their strengths and weaknesses can complement each other?  Worth exploring.

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Liberty603 on July 01, 2011, 02:59:24 pm
From the perspective of a casual attendee (did not volunteer, should have, will next year...):

Porcfest was great this year, and seemed well-organized. If there were any major problems, I didn't notice them. Also, for the record, Curtis did an awesome job with online promotion.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 01, 2011, 05:33:41 pm
Curtis has had enough of a power trip for 2 years, it's time to find someone else.

I'm sorry, who are you?
you don't want to know
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Russell Kanning on July 01, 2011, 05:46:30 pm
That is sad to hear Michelle.
We all agree that results are most important .... and it does seem as though Curtis promoted and helped plan a good porcfest.
I thought we all could suffer through his egotism while he did this work. My wife has to put up with tons too. :)
It is sad that all the people you know and respect thought it went so poorly. I kept hearing such good things on this forum.
I didn't go this year, but I have enjoyed Porcfests in the past that were not perfect either.
Maybe I don't have that high of a standard for these events or the organizers. It just seems like fun.
I hope things get better.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dreepa on July 02, 2011, 06:57:43 am
more folks attend to air their grievances.


We had Festivus at Porcfest?

Damn I missed it.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dave Mincin on July 02, 2011, 02:10:25 pm
Just curious....Through the years I have developed a bit of a relationship with Crosby, the owner of Rogers.  Consequently he often brings up his concerns about what is shaking down at PorcFest to me.  He had a number of concerns this year.  Just wondering if anyone among the organizers talked to Crosby, or did anything to address his concerns?
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: robin.freiheit on July 02, 2011, 04:38:51 pm
I saw Curtis speak with him on a very regular basis throughout PorcFest. So I am sure his concerns did not go unnoticed.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Ti K on July 02, 2011, 06:23:58 pm
This was my first PorcFest.

The first thing I noticed when I started the 'deeper dive' into the registration process and getting familiar with all of the events and happenings is that Curtis' name kept popping up everywhere. He even responded to my Facebook messages within minutes of me shooting them off. Color me super impressed.

Now, I am sure that behind the scenes, many balls have been dropped and an untold number of things have fallen through the cracks, but let's step back for a moment and look at this with a fresh set of eyes: Do the poo-pooers honestly expect any one organizer to pull this massive event off without a hitch?

I regularly interact with professional event coordinators at work who get frazzled organizing events that are a fraction of the scale of PF. The job requires nerves of steel and the ability to stop worrying about what other people think about you in order to get shit done. If you're one of the people affected by Curtis' "mismanagement", then it wouldn't be a bad idea to step up to the plate and help out with next year's planning. The more decentralized this becomes, the better, IMO.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: elkingrey on July 02, 2011, 06:52:38 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dave Mincin on July 02, 2011, 07:11:13 pm
I saw Curtis speak with him on a very regular basis throughout PorcFest. So I am sure his concerns did not go unnoticed.

Thanks Robin for your quick response to my inquiry.  I don't know if his issues were addressed, but I wonder why he came to me if they were?  I do know that there were serious issue presented by the owner of Roger's, but I don't know if they were addressed.  Perhaps Curtis could shine more light on this?

My only concern is PorcFest will grow and prosper, but keep in mind we are dealing with rural NH, and we have to address there concerns.

Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Trenks on July 02, 2011, 07:16:27 pm
The event was phenomenally awesome. I don't know if that has anything to do with any of the organizer's.  I do think they did a great job. I've heard a lot about. Curtis "egoism"  i see what they are saying. I don't care. However,  it probably would be a good idea to just have a different front man/woman (woman probably better)  I am an excellent organizer myself, but I would sell more tickets if I had a cute teenager doing all the talking.  as far the pot incident,  I agree with Ian and others on that. What is overlooked is the larger phenomena of a unique character most likely to cater to similar characters.   With Curtis you are always going to have the younger people and agorists / Voluntaryists more happy in general than older minarchist families.  But if you have a 50 year old minarchist doing the organizing, more minarchists and families will be satisfied than will younger Voluntarists.  It will never be prefect.  
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Trenks on July 02, 2011, 07:19:18 pm
For the record I am "Voluntary Trenqs" on FB and owner of Windigee food truck.  Just treasury on free Keene.  I know it needs to be consistent.  I also think RVs should be allowed in the valley.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Dave Mincin on July 02, 2011, 07:19:50 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.

I don't know how many folks Roger's can handle, but I do know it is the largest privately owned CG in NH.  I do know that Crosby (owner) is the only person, place, that would afford us the opportunity to put on the type of event PorcFest has become.

My concern is if we don't start paying a little more attention to his concerns we could loose everything.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: FTL_Ian on July 03, 2011, 01:34:05 am
Robin,

I heard many complaints from people who were asking if there was a closing ceremony / debrief, as apparently it was not on the schedule.

I also agree it was the best Porcfest ever.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: sj on July 03, 2011, 11:16:00 am
more folks attend to air their grievances.


We had Festivus at Porcfest?

Damn I missed it.

I did see feats of strength.

There was also a pole without decoration.  Well, .... now that I think of it, I wouldn't say it had no decoration...

Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: robin.freiheit on July 03, 2011, 12:08:30 pm
I agree the closing ceremony totally got away from us. we did have a debrief, it should have been announced better, there were only a handful of us in attendance for that and we did get a list of things that need to happen to make next year even better. I can't speak for anyone other than myself but I was so exhausted and burnt out on working by the last day that I know I was not at the top of my game at the very end.




Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Nitro9a on July 03, 2011, 12:21:40 pm
I don't think that it is at all appropriate to have this conversation on a forum, especially a public one that anyone can see.  I don't know the whole situation but whatever mistakes were made, Porcfest seems like an incredible amount of work and I can't imagine that Curtis should deserve this kind of public criticism.  At the same time, I can't understand why Curtis' reaction is to publicly bash Osbourne who doesn't seem to be at all involved in this conversation.
Why doesn't everyone who cares about this issue get together in person?  The internet wall seems to have the effect of removing people's filters, allowing them to speak without the respect and courtesy that most people would have for each other when face to face.  This can only make any problem worse.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Floridian on July 03, 2011, 12:58:05 pm
Porc Fest was great, but where can we see the group photo in question?

Since this is turning into a suggestions thread, I suggest that future Porc Fests be held in summer.  8)  Just sayin.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: freedomroad on July 03, 2011, 01:11:42 pm
Since this is turning into a suggestions thread, I suggest that future Porc Fests be held in summer.  8)  Just sayin.

It was, all but the 1st day, anyway.  Porcfest 2012 will be in summer too, except for the first 2 days.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: robin.freiheit on July 03, 2011, 02:00:46 pm
The internet wall seems to have the effect of removing people's filters, allowing them to speak without the respect and courtesy that most people would have for each other when face to face.  This can only make any problem worse.

I agree
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on July 03, 2011, 09:34:33 pm
I saw Curtis speak with him on a very regular basis throughout PorcFest. So I am sure his concerns did not go unnoticed.

Thanks Robin for your quick response to my inquiry.  I don't know if his issues were addressed, but I wonder why he came to me if they were?  I do know that there were serious issue presented by the owner of Roger's, but I don't know if they were addressed.  Perhaps Curtis could shine more light on this?


I spoke (sometimes at length) with Crosby about half a dozen times, every day (in addition to his staff, who had one of my radios).
Other than the parking and liquor issues, and his being on the look out for locals on Sat night, I dont recall many concerns/issues.
I also had time to talk to him all day Monday, after everyone had left, and he was a happy camper.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on July 03, 2011, 09:38:03 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.

Around 2k

No clue what will happen if/when PorcFest outgrows Roger's. One possibility is to raise the ticket price, but I'd prefer to move in the opposite direction.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: jeancoutu on July 03, 2011, 11:09:52 pm

I regularly interact with professional event coordinators at work who get frazzled organizing events that are a fraction of the scale of PF. The job requires nerves of steel and the ability to stop worrying about what other people think about you in order to get shit done. If you're one of the people affected by Curtis' "mismanagement", then it wouldn't be a bad idea to step up to the plate and help out with next year's planning. The more decentralized this becomes, the better, IMO.

Tell me about it!! "Frazzled" is putting it lightly...Keep in mind too organizing events dealing with activists are even tougher where they being all protesters, they protest & argue with ya about everything, lol.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: robin.freiheit on July 04, 2011, 09:12:44 am
we need to buy our own campground  ;D ;D
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 04, 2011, 09:54:02 am
we need to buy our own campground  ;D ;D

It's been discussed.

Takes a good chunk of change to build something equivalent to Roger's.  The campground part is relatively easy, but many will insist on a motel, meeting rooms, and such.  Those parts cost a lot more.

Find some folks with significant money to invest, who are willing to see mortgage-level returns, not venture-capital-level returns (building a campground, in this economy, could make money, but not huge amounts), and we could get somewhere.

Campground, we could do for a couple hundred thousand dollars, nicely.  Motel and such, though, and all the amenities that Roger's has, would push it upwards of a million dollars (maybe significantly upwards, depending upon exactly what amenities and how large the motel must be).

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Floridian on July 04, 2011, 03:23:07 pm
Since this is turning into a suggestions thread, I suggest that future Porc Fests be held in summer.  8)  Just sayin.

It was, all but the 1st day, anyway.  Porcfest 2012 will be in summer too, except for the first 2 days.

Technically calendar summer yes, but weatherwise, not so much.   
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 04, 2011, 04:21:25 pm
we need to buy our own campground  ;D ;D

It's been discussed.

Takes a good chunk of change to build something equivalent to Roger's.  The campground part is relatively easy, but many will insist on a motel, meeting rooms, and such.  Those parts cost a lot more.

Find some folks with significant money to invest, who are willing to see mortgage-level returns, not venture-capital-level returns (building a campground, in this economy, could make money, but not huge amounts), and we could get somewhere.

Campground, we could do for a couple hundred thousand dollars, nicely.  Motel and such, though, and all the amenities that Roger's has, would push it upwards of a million dollars (maybe significantly upwards, depending upon exactly what amenities and how large the motel must be).

Joe

Good analysis, Joe. Sounds right to me. Still, eventually, it would be nice for FSP to have an HQ on a large plot of land with several structures that could serve as the home of Porcfest.

I suppose our tithes would have to ramp up dramatically for FSP to afford this, though. Perhaps FSP should have a classification for a member who donates more than X hours or X dollars per year to the cause.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 04, 2011, 04:22:38 pm
Since this is turning into a suggestions thread, I suggest that future Porc Fests be held in summer.  8)  Just sayin.

It was, all but the 1st day, anyway.  Porcfest 2012 will be in summer too, except for the first 2 days.

Technically calendar summer yes, but weatherwise, not so much.   

If it's too hot, people get cranky.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: elkingrey on July 04, 2011, 04:24:59 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.

Around 2k

No clue what will happen if/when PorcFest outgrows Roger's. One possibility is to raise the ticket price, but I'd prefer to move in the opposite direction.

Well, one nice thing about raising ticket prices would be that there would less likely be a budget shortfall. But that's definitely not the preferred solution given that within a few year's time there will be more than 2k free staters alone, not to mention Porcfest attendees from out of state. Is there any chance of Crosby expanding Roger's Campground? That would be sweet.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on July 04, 2011, 04:27:40 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.

Around 2k

No clue what will happen if/when PorcFest outgrows Roger's. One possibility is to raise the ticket price, but I'd prefer to move in the opposite direction.

Well, one nice thing about raising ticket prices would be that there would less likely be a budget shortfall. But that's definitely not the preferred solution given that within a few year's time there will be more than 2k free staters alone, not to mention Porcfest attendees from out of state. Is there any chance of Crosby expanding Roger's Campground? That would be sweet.


No, he'd sell it before he sunk any more money into it. ($millions, in case you were wondering)
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 04, 2011, 04:45:55 pm
Does anybody know what the carrying capacity of Roger's Campground is? What's going to happen when 10,000 people show up to Porcfest? Is there a larger campground in New Hampshire? Just curious.

Around 2k

No clue what will happen if/when PorcFest outgrows Roger's. One possibility is to raise the ticket price, but I'd prefer to move in the opposite direction.

Well, one nice thing about raising ticket prices would be that there would less likely be a budget shortfall. But that's definitely not the preferred solution given that within a few year's time there will be more than 2k free staters alone, not to mention Porcfest attendees from out of state. Is there any chance of Crosby expanding Roger's Campground? That would be sweet.


No, he'd sell it before he sunk any more money into it. ($millions, in case you were wondering)

Maybe he'll be selling when FSP is looking to buy =D
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 04, 2011, 05:02:51 pm
Remember, the FSP has the goal of getting folks to move to NH.  It doesn't "exist" within NH.  A "FSP headquarters" here in NH would be contrary that methodology.

If the funding were there, several of us would probably try to create something similar in effect (campground with meeting rooms and such, capable of hosting something like PorcFest, and liberty-friendly the rest of the year), but not directly associated with the FSP.  It could be a private project by those who support the FSP's goals, but I can't imagine the FSP actually taking any direct part in such a thing.

Anyone comes up with the money, I'll be happy to build it, and pay interest on the loan.  Until then...

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 04, 2011, 08:44:38 pm
Remember, the FSP has the goal of getting folks to move to NH.  It doesn't "exist" within NH.  A "FSP headquarters" here in NH would be contrary that methodology.

If the funding were there, several of us would probably try to create something similar in effect (campground with meeting rooms and such, capable of hosting something like PorcFest, and liberty-friendly the rest of the year), but not directly associated with the FSP.  It could be a private project by those who support the FSP's goals, but I can't imagine the FSP actually taking any direct part in such a thing.

Anyone comes up with the money, I'll be happy to build it, and pay interest on the loan.  Until then...

Joe

Why can't the FSP have a headquarters? Surely PF does more toward "getting folks to move to New Hampshire" than any other single effort...
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 04, 2011, 08:50:29 pm
Why can't the FSP have a headquarters? Surely PF does more toward "getting folks to move to New Hampshire" than any other single effort...

Because the FSP works outside of NH, to get folks to move here.  They have no need of a headquarters in NH.  What would they do with it?  Almost all work is done online, these days.

Spending millions of dollars buying a campground to host a once-yearly event would not be an effective use of funds.  Sure, PorcFest does a great deal for the FSP, but if the FSP had millions of dollars sitting around, there are much better uses to which that money could be put, which would deliver more bang for the buck than PorcFest.  It's not that PorcFest isn't valuable, but just that it's not valued in the millions of dollars.

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 04, 2011, 09:48:14 pm
Why can't the FSP have a headquarters? Surely PF does more toward "getting folks to move to New Hampshire" than any other single effort...

Because the FSP works outside of NH, to get folks to move here.  They have no need of a headquarters in NH.  What would they do with it?  Almost all work is done online, these days.

Spending millions of dollars buying a campground to host a once-yearly event would not be an effective use of funds.  Sure, PorcFest does a great deal for the FSP, but if the FSP had millions of dollars sitting around, there are much better uses to which that money could be put, which would deliver more bang for the buck than PorcFest.  It's not that PorcFest isn't valuable, but just that it's not valued in the millions of dollars.

Joe

Fair enough about ROI. I think we could benefit from more meeting places in meatspace, though. Shouldn't every town in NH have a voluntarist clubhouse?

Regarding the OP, I thought Curtis did a fine job and it seems that most attendees had a blast. Just because we want to smash the state doesn't mean we need to smash anyone who tries to accomplish anything, anywhere. He worked hard for us and if he's up for it, I'd be happy to have that same PF experience again.
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: MaineShark on July 04, 2011, 11:12:22 pm
Fair enough about ROI. I think we could benefit from more meeting places in meatspace, though. Shouldn't every town in NH have a voluntarist clubhouse?

234 clubhouses might be a bit much.  One per county would probably be more than sufficient, at this point.  I doubt there's even enough demand, currently, for that, until more move.

Joe
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Sovereign Curtis on July 04, 2011, 11:55:13 pm
Why can't the FSP have a headquarters? Surely PF does more toward "getting folks to move to New Hampshire" than any other single effort...

Because the FSP works outside of NH, to get folks to move here.  They have no need of a headquarters in NH.  What would they do with it?  Almost all work is done online, these days.

Spending millions of dollars buying a campground to host a once-yearly event would not be an effective use of funds.  Sure, PorcFest does a great deal for the FSP, but if the FSP had millions of dollars sitting around, there are much better uses to which that money could be put, which would deliver more bang for the buck than PorcFest.  It's not that PorcFest isn't valuable, but just that it's not valued in the millions of dollars.

Joe

Fair enough about ROI. I think we could benefit from more meeting places in meatspace, though. Shouldn't every town in NH have a voluntarist clubhouse?

Regarding the OP, I thought Curtis did a fine job and it seems that most attendees had a blast. Just because we want to smash the state doesn't mean we need to smash anyone who tries to accomplish anything, anywhere. He worked hard for us and if he's up for it, I'd be happy to have that same PF experience again.


Thank you for your kind words. Were I to take part again, however, it wouldn't be the same experience. It'd be better ;-)
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 05, 2011, 12:58:45 am
Fair enough about ROI. I think we could benefit from more meeting places in meatspace, though. Shouldn't every town in NH have a voluntarist clubhouse?

234 clubhouses might be a bit much.  One per county would probably be more than sufficient, at this point.  I doubt there's even enough demand, currently, for that, until more move.

Joe

Okay, maybe I meant every major town/city/area. I'm thinking Portsmouth, Manchester, Keene, Nashua, Lakes Region, White Mountains...
Title: Re: New Event Organizer for PorcFest 2012
Post by: Porcsmouth on July 05, 2011, 12:59:51 am
Why can't the FSP have a headquarters? Surely PF does more toward "getting folks to move to New Hampshire" than any other single effort...

Because the FSP works outside of NH, to get folks to move here.  They have no need of a headquarters in NH.  What would they do with it?  Almost all work is done online, these days.

Spending millions of dollars buying a campground to host a once-yearly event would not be an effective use of funds.  Sure, PorcFest does a great deal for the FSP, but if the FSP had millions of dollars sitting around, there are much better uses to which that money could be put, which would deliver more bang for the buck than PorcFest.  It's not that PorcFest isn't valuable, but just that it's not valued in the millions of dollars.

Joe

Fair enough about ROI. I think we could benefit from more meeting places in meatspace, though. Shouldn't every town in NH have a voluntarist clubhouse?

Regarding the OP, I thought Curtis did a fine job and it seems that most attendees had a blast. Just because we want to smash the state doesn't mean we need to smash anyone who tries to accomplish anything, anywhere. He worked hard for us and if he's up for it, I'd be happy to have that same PF experience again.


Thank you for your kind words. Were I to take part again, however, it wouldn't be the same experience. It'd be better ;-)

He's throwin' down the gauntlet y'all...