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Topic: For the atheists that lurk in the religion/liberty section of this forum (Read 157533 times)
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BagOfEyebrows
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lots of people wrote about the event of his rising from his own death he most certainly was not written or said to have gone around eating brains afterwards, or doing anything Zombie-like. But have your fun and laughs! :p
Keep in mind the people writing about the alleged event were writing many decades and hundreds of years after. But brains? Who said anything about eating brains? Why do you hate the previously deceased and subsequently re-animated? Shame on you for judging them! Maybe when some bureaucrats stop hating. I know about the timespans between the events (10C's, Christ's birth and death and zombie rising from the dead) - I always keep that all in mind. I also constantly think about man's nature... especially with writing. Especially with 'interpretation' - and edits/omissions. And political influence. And religious influence. And atheist influence. And 'legal' influence. Could we maybe try something? Maybe we could talk a little bit, sentence by sentence, about the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, as written by John Adams? I mean, I kinda really want to get back to the Professor... and the part where you painfully but determinedly hoist yourself up by your back to twist the rope around to untie yourself from the tree and then you go back to Smokey the dog and the guy in the garage without me (to my utter horror!) for a one-on-one chat, and I really, really, really want to get to scrollin' text out in the universe -the other book- part and I neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed to get to the part about Mike's room and Julio, O's, Mike and the Teenager's shenanigans and a little closet adventure between Julio and the Teenager, but I wouldn't mind a break and breather in between getting back to all that to have a serious and non-cussy discussion with you on: the preamble the rights self governance manmade law (by consent) law *of* 'inhaibitants' vs laws *of* travelers through rights vs privalege the difference between a commonwealth and a state how John Adams pictured liberty/freedom functioning in diversity and lawfullness/morality You could tell me if you think the guy was nuts for trying to do what he did - give a people the written instructions to peacefully coexist in liberty and freedom, while simultaneously keeping the law system intact for those who wanted an alternate source to go by - voluntarily. I see the man who brought your field of expertise here to this land mass as being a genius - for trying so hard to seperate it from the tyranny of manmade hierarchy. If you don't wanna do that, I'll understand - it could be tedious. But we could go real slow and all. And we wouldn't have to set a timeframe or anything. We could just be relaxed about it. I might occasionally burst into story when I need a break from too much serious discussion, though - it is Fight Club, after all. |
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BagOfEyebrows
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dance break - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfmJf3DSKFY"I don't wanna rule the world - I just wanna run my life" I don't want it run by: mankind's 'law system', some members of academia, or sets of conflicting religious doctrine, "scientists" or "philosophers" I won't: infringe on anyone's rights - I won't lie, cheat, steal, break promises, kill or murder, covet/conspire/scheme ways to get your property or take your life. This is my foundation; I want to live with it as supreme. I don't *need* you to live by it - I WANT TO LIVE BY IT. |
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B.D. Ross
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the preamble
the rights
self governance
manmade law (by consent)
law *of* 'inhaibitants' vs laws *of* travelers through
rights vs privalege
the difference between a commonwealth and a state
how John Adams pictured liberty/freedom functioning in diversity and lawfullness/morality
The floor is open. |
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freestatelaw.com - Get plugged in with what you need to know about New Hampshire law and legislative efforts.
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John Edward Mercier
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LOL.
Just watching a special on John Adams and the letter Abigail wrote about inclusion of women in the new government.
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BagOfEyebrows
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the preamble
the rights
self governance
manmade law (by consent)
law *of* 'inhaibitants' vs laws *of* travelers through
rights vs privalege
the difference between a commonwealth and a state
how John Adams pictured liberty/freedom functioning in diversity and lawfullness/morality
The floor is open. *gasp* Today? Right now?! I thought you were gonna make me wait a few more days or somethin'! now you'll have to wait; I'm dancing on the floor you just opened, to some Janet Jackson. :p (just kidding - I'll start on it as soon as I'm outta another heavy-duty discussion about morality/ethics with Mr. Ruff on facebook.) You caught me off guard - I bet you're happy. :p |
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BagOfEyebrows
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LOL.
Just watching a special on John Adams and the letter Abigail wrote about inclusion of women in the new government.
Abigail rocked!  Men can be such... control freaks. Protection and punishment! Woot woot! Control! ::: Jam, Rebel! GOT MY OWN MIND. I WANNA MAKE MY OWN DECISISONS! *moon walk* *spin* *hat tip* ::: mmmm... the superior sex... the superior intellect... hahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaheeeeeeeeheeeeeeeeeeee! *grabs crotch* |
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BagOfEyebrows
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It might take a while, Ross, for me to get into the right calm, cool, soft-spoken John Adams discussion mode here; I'm all jacked up on Starburst, Twizzlers and soda - and I've been kinda extra-hyper all day. Sorta like I wanna just dance or something. Like I want to spin around on the front lawn - I was just out there, and it's a little breezy, but it's very nice. I've got a bit more yardwork to catch up on this weekend, with the early arrival of spring. But I will get something all serious typed out at some point and start it - I'm just way, way, way too zany right now to even attempt it.
I think I used up all my 'serious zone' energy with Mr. Ruff ~
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BagOfEyebrows
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PREAMBLE.
The end of the institution, maintenance, and administration of government, is to secure the existence of the body politic, to protect it, and to furnish the individuals who compose it with the power of enjoying in safety and tranquillity their natural rights, and the blessings of life: and whenever these great objects are not obtained, the people have a right to alter the government, and to take measures necessary for their safety, prosperity and happiness.
The body politic is formed by a voluntary association of individuals: it is a social compact, by which the whole people covenants with each citizen, and each citizen with the whole people, that all shall be governed by certain laws for the common good. It is the duty of the people, therefore, in framing a constitution of government, to provide for an equitable mode of making laws, as well as for an impartial interpretation, and a faithful execution of them; that every man may, at all times, find his security in them.
We, therefore, the people of Massachusetts, acknowledging, with grateful hearts, the goodness of the great Legislator of the universe, in affording us, in the course of His providence, an opportunity, deliberately and peaceably, without fraud, violence or surprise, of entering into an original, explicit, and solemn compact with each other; and of forming a new constitution of civil government, for ourselves and posterity; and devoutly imploring His direction in so interesting a design, do agree upon, ordain and establish the following Declaration of Rights, and Frame of Government, as the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts.
There's only four sentences. John was a run-on sentence, steady flow of thought kind of guy. We'll start with the first one.
The end of the institution, maintenance, and administration of government, is to secure the existence of the body politic, to protect it, and to furnish the individuals who compose it with the power of enjoying in safety and tranquillity their natural rights, and the blessings of life: and whenever these great objects are not obtained, the people have a right to alter the government, and to take measures necessary for their safety, prosperity and happiness.
This outlines the goal (re: end), the people it is meant for (re: those who compose it, which is not 'everyone', as sentence two elaborates more upon), establishes that the protection of it is up to those who compose it to determine the ways by which it will be protected (which the people of Massachusetts never did do, as they never clarified or extended upon Article 8 with any amendment to show they had decided upon the manner by which it would be protected), and the reasons by which it should and could be changed (a humble statement of 'this might not work out as I intend it to', as well as a warning that the entire philosophy and the concepts within the philosophy of self-governing could potentially be manipulated away from those who compose it, towards a different and destructive end, and it establishes a natural right of alteration to fix any 'bugs' that might be in this established code of self-governing.)
That's how I read it - let me know if you read it differently.
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BagOfEyebrows
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Dearest and Most Patient B.D. Ross, Before I head outside to play in the dirt and growth for a while, just wanted to ask you to remember that the Constitution for the Commonwealth of Massachusetts was written approximately 3 years after Jefferson's Declaration of Independence (1776), and 8 long years before John's involvement in the federal Constitutional Convention (1787)- it was ratified by the people of Massachusetts in 1780 - he had a much, much different idea about self-governing than most of the attendees at the CC, and eventually did cave in to their ideology. That will become clearer and more apparent as we take this document piece by piece to unravel and reveal the true intent it hoped to achieve. I do not have much admiration for John Adam's federal years in office or his writings or philosophies of that timeframe- I ask that you consider what he was trying to put together back in 1779 from a 'clean slate' frame of mind in regards to him (re: try not to think about the Alien and Sedition Acts nor his other federal atrocities.) Give his initial outline of self-governing a clean look - untarnished by his filthy, corrupt and unprincipled 'power corrupts' years - I think you'll be amazed by what you find, Ross. Most humbly and respectfully yours, in philosophy and in liberty, Boe p.s. I might not be in for hours; it's a freakin' gorgeous day outside. But, taking it slow and careful like is the way to go with this, anyway. No rush; gentle, gentle, gentle... (yes, I'm talking about the constitutiion of Massachusetts...  I swear it!) |
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B.D. Ross
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That's how I read it - let me know if you read it differently.
The government's purpose is to protect the people's natural rights and liberties. When the government fails, the people have a right to alter the government to achieve those purposes.
A social compact voluntarily binds the people of this state so that each citizen agrees that everyone is subject to laws made for the common good. Necessarily, the people must then provide for fair ways of making, interpreting, and executing those laws so that everyone will be protected.
To achieve this, we, the the people of Massachussetts, declare the following Declaration of Rights and Frame of Government as our Constitution for a new civil government.Fairly standard fare as far as constitutions go, both with and without flowery language. |
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« Last Edit: April 11, 2010, 03:10:17 pm by B.D. Ross »
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freestatelaw.com - Get plugged in with what you need to know about New Hampshire law and legislative efforts.
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BagOfEyebrows
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That's how I read it - let me know if you read it differently.
The government's purpose is to protect the people's natural rights and liberties. When the government fails, the people have a right to alter the government to achieve those purposes.
A social compact voluntarily binds the people of this state so that each citizen agrees that everyone is subject to laws made for the common good. Necessarily, the people must then provide for fair ways of making, interpreting, and executing those laws so that everyone will be protected.
To achieve this, we, the the people of Massachussetts, declare the following Declaration of Rights and Frame of Government as our Constitution for a new civil government.Fairly standard fare as far as constitutions go, both with and without flowery language. Hold the boat here - who fucking deleted what I wrote after the John Adams discussion appeal? WAS IT YOU?! WHO FUCKING DELETED WHAT I WROTE? There were two or three other things written in between the approach for the John Adams Constitutional discussion thing and the line "you tease" - WHO FUCKING DELETED WHAT I WROTE? Just fess up if it was you - tell me in private if you want, tell me via email: BagOfEyebrows@gmail.com or by fuckin' facebook or by fuckin' phone - 5083177145 - I don't fucking care HOW I'm told, I just want to know who in the fuck is censoring me and why - WTF. WHICHEVER OF YOU COCK HEADED MALE DOUCHE SUCKERS FUCKING DELETED WHAT I WROTE, CONTACT ME WITH THE REASON WHY. Actually, if it was you, Ross, no need to tell me why - I ain't fuckin' stupid, and neither are you - I just want to know what fucking moderator thinks what I wrote right there was somehow 'wrong' or 'bad' or whatever, if it wasn't you - Outta all fucking things to fuckin' delete - GOD DAMN IT. If it was you - your mod authority on this forum to delete shit should be fuckin' stripped from you - you'll end up deleting half the shit I write, you fuckin' Commie - FUCK YOU! Apologies in advance if it wasn't you - but if it was, God DAMN it, Ross, deleting it just fuckin' proves it all to be true, are you a fuckin' idiot? *SMACK* Stop acting like a fuckin' baby! We're fuckin' adults - I can handle shit and so can you, it's not as hard as you think or feel, don't FUCK WITH MY WRITING IN HERE! PRICK. |
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BagOfEyebrows
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That's how I read it - let me know if you read it differently.
The government's purpose is to protect the people's natural rights and liberties. When the government fails, the people have a right to alter the government to achieve those purposes.
A social compact voluntarily binds the people of this state so that each citizen agrees that everyone is subject to laws made for the common good. Necessarily, the people must then provide for fair ways of making, interpreting, and executing those laws so that everyone will be protected.
To achieve this, we, the the people of Massachussetts, declare the following Declaration of Rights and Frame of Government as our Constitution for a new civil government.Fairly standard fare as far as constitutions go, both with and without flowery language. And we were on sentence fuckin' one - you went and gave your interpretation of the whole fuckin' thing, which we'll get back to in a more decent and civil form when I find out who is being a fucking forum Nazi with my writing. Son of a fuckin' bitch - I was looking forward, after a long day out in the yard, to sit down and settle in with a nice fuckin' calm discussion, too - instead, one of you fuckers took my words away - for no good reason, too. (unless it was you, Ross - then, I get it - but what the fuck!? Don't FUCKING do THAT!) |
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