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Author Topic: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?  (Read 8837 times)

UCCO2004

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Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« on: April 22, 2014, 11:41:17 am »

I am an unemployed Generation Xer trying to live in Cincinnati, surrounded by arrogant people who don't care about me, even with five or more years of college attendance.

I am currently on food stamps, because my parents want me to "get their tax money back", even though they probably could afford $200 a month toward my groceries with their vast wealth.

I am also on Medicaid, mostly because private insurance companies can't provide renewable hospital-only insurance policies, but also because of something else that makes no sense:

In 1997, my mother made her second suicide attempt with sleeping pills.  After I called the ambulance to save her life, my father came home and started yelling at me, then forced me to attend her therapy sessions with social workers and psychiatrists, even though I didn't do anything personally.  I was immediately criticized for having "a narcissistic personality disorder" just because I didn't think I should suffer for what other people in my family were doing.  I was then diagnosed with bipolar disorder, which supposedly runs in my mother's side of the family, and placed on almost identical medications to my mother.  No one in my family besides myself was ever expected to attend these therapy sessions, none of them were ever branded with bipolar disorder, and now my mother doesn't even attend psychiatric therapy, since it has been 15 years or more. 

But my parents expect me to see psychiatrists as a condition of living with them, and yet their generation won't give me a job outside their home, which would emancipate me from their rules and let me become a responsible adult.  As a result, I am in my late thirties, still living with my parents, and forced to take medications that have made me fat, even though I was in shape as recently as 2004, and at a healthy weight as recently as 2008.  I recently spent most of a $1250 tax credit on a BowFlex MAX M3 trainer, which may allow me to lose the weight eventually, but in the meantime, I am still unemployed.  I did not apply for unemployment compensation when I resigned from my last job in 2013, as a result of being assaulted by a co-worker and then being harassed verbally by a supervisor repeatedly, but my father wants me to sign up for SSDI.  I have been in contact with an Ohio official who works for the agency responsible for disability determination, and I know someone who currently receives $700 per month because she qualified for disability.

My question to libertarians who may be reading this is simply:  We live in a mixed economy that Demopublican politicians have wrecked in the last 10-20 years, and it's their fault we are expected to have college to get a job, even though they won't treat you fairly if you are hired, and they get rid of you suddenly like you're nothing to them.  So is it acceptable for me to take SSDI, if it might pay for me to finish the remaining 1.5 years toward my bachelor's degree through University of Phoenix in the short-term, and then allow me to get away from my parents after age forty by acquiring a condominium of my own that the $700 per month would pay for?  I might make better than $9-$10 an hour if I have a bachelor's degree, assuming that the job lasts.  I am also physically and mentally able to work at least part-time for money toward groceries, car payments, gasoline, and student loans, even if they do award SSDI.  The decision may take up to six months, but I am supposed to be getting paperwork in the mail that will allow them to look at my medical records, so it might happen sooner.

In the meantime, how many of you sympathize with me, and how many of you think that none of this would even be an issue if other people were as nice to me as I am to them?
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MaineShark

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2014, 12:54:16 pm »

Is it libertarian to do so?  Absolutely not.

Is it something that some folks who are trying to live in this imperfect world will do?  Certainly.
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dalebert

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2014, 06:40:52 pm »

I'm using my VA benefits.  :-[

Liberty603

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2014, 07:36:33 pm »

Sounds extremely frustrating. IMHO, don't stress over getting some of your parents' tax dollars back (or mine, for that matter - I'm glad they're going to you rather than more corporate welfare or senseless war).

Hope things come together for you and hope to see you in New Hampshire soon  :)
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winterboarder

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2014, 11:17:28 pm »

It sounds like you are a victim of your parents and devolved into a shitty situation. They put you through the system and they keep you drudged up. The best thing to do is to get the hell out of that house. If you don't you will die there. They will be the end of you. Screw the SSDI and look for a job anywhere. If you want to go to NH look there. Do everything possible to be your own master and life will look a lot better. Applying for SSDI is like exchanging parental support for a even shittier parent (the government). You will never be free unless you take responsibility for your life, do what is necessary to be self sufficient and independent. That is libertarian.
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UCCO2004

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2014, 05:37:56 pm »

I realize that times change.  I didn't have the smooth transition into adult life I should have had:  My parents lost their business in 1992 in the last recession that defined politics.  In 1993, I was psychologically bullied by certain groups of people at school, including my pro-levy activist art teacher and the female sycophants around her.  That year, my parents also forced me to take drivers' ed on top of increasing homework, and were trying to make me attend college at UC-Blue Ash, even though the highway connecting us to Blue Ash wasn't even built yet.  The next year, my parents wanted me to get a job and an apartment at 17, even though my lack of high school diploma only allowed me a part-time minimum wage job (nowhere near enough for rent!), and eventually they relented to the point my [late] grandfather cut a door into the next room to double my living quarters in place of getting an apartment. 

I graduated in 1995 with an Honors Diploma and a Career Passport, but after I found a great job at Forest Fair Mall, I was abruptly laid off in 1996 when the owner divorced his wife and moved back to Taiwan.  I did a year of liberal arts classes at UC-Blue Ash and worked several jobs thereafter, doubling my wages to $10 an hour by 1999.  But then I was downsized, and tired of changing jobs, I went back to college at UC-Blue Ash by 2000.  I made $15 an hour doing web design for professors, and finished two associate technical degrees by 2004.  But the economy wasn't good under Bush Jr. (who I didn't vote for in 2000 OR 2004), and I could only get a job for $11 an hour in 2005.  This was enough to pay my bills, but not enough to get a place of my own.  Then he laid me off, and I spent 2006 unemployed, and on public assistance for the first time ever, which I scrupulously avoided in the '90s.  I did find another job by the end of 2006, but they downsized me by March 2007, and I went back to UC to try for my bachelor's degree. 

Immediately, they wanted me to do extra "Breadth of Knowledge" liberal arts classes (probably to create jobs for professors -- I was already a 3.4 GPA student in liberal arts) and then wouldn't transfer my credits in studio drawing to main campus for my B.F.A. in Digital Design.  So they wanted me to take 3 years of classes to finish my bachelor's degree.  I spent two quarters in a holding pattern at UC-Blue Ash doing "Breadth of Knowledge", then found it difficult to do the 18-credit-hour schedule on main campus in fall 2007, then passed with mostly B's in the next two quarters of 2008.  I was doing okay and holding my own at main campus, when suddenly the "Academic Progress Appeals Committee" decided that it would take too many full-time-quarter-equivalents to finish, so they cut off my loans.  My parents wouldn't pay a dime for my education, either; they were too busy traveling and saving for their holy Baby Boom retirement.  I was so disgusted with this situation I decided to switch colleges, and gave up on UC entirely.  [I still have a "Proud Alum" sticker on my car because I was the first student to complete two A.A.B.s in the Art Department at UC-Blue Ash, but I refuse to give money to UC itself until their education finds me a job one day.]

Fortunately, the University of Phoenix had recently started advertising in the Cincinnati area, and they had by now relaxed their requirement that every student has to have a job to attend classes; now they just insist that you have to have "access to a business environment".  I started classes in January 2010, initially as a Business major, but switched to Marketing because I couldn't do college-level accounting.  I continued to take classes through May 2011, when my undergraduate loans were maxed out, and they expected an estimated $12,000 personal financial contribution to finish my B.S. in Marketing and Sales Communication.  Phoenix was far more convenient than UC, and more libertarian because it's a publicly-traded private college, but they charge a lot for tuition because they are private.  My father acted offended when I told him that I needed help finishing my baccalaureate (to overcome the prejudice of his generation about college!) but he relented and offered me a private $6,000 loan -- if I first saved $6,000 myself toward Phoenix.  Since I had few options at this point in time, I decided to look for a job.

By 2012, I took a job as a Truck Unloader at the local Meijer Supercenter.  Although it was a union job (UFCW Local #75), it only paid minimum wage.  I lost thirty pounds working the job, but was still overweight, and wasn't making hardly any money to save toward Phoenix.  After a year on the job, I was only making $8.25 an hour.  I had to take a deferment on my student loans to have any spending money whatsoever.  I was so worn out by the job itself that I wasn't using the exercise bike in my second room hardly at all, and never even touched my TriFlex because my body was usually sore.  By July 2013, I had enough time accrued that I could take a vacation, and I chose to accompany my parents on their vacation to California.  [It was one of very few vacations they were even willing to take me on in the past twenty years; my father had abruptly cut off travel in 1994, claiming "we're going to have to curtail our travels", but for some reason he always had money to take my mother on vacations; and they outright refused to take me on their Chicago vacation in 1997, where we had a good time five years earlier, the year my mother came home to attempt suicide.]

Unfortunately, one of my co-workers who was a taller, arrogant, "alpha male" Marine Reservist assaulted me on the job, after a display of stuffing had toppled over; I guess Marines can't wait to bully someone else, with or without orders.  He cursed at me, spit on me with his tobacco-dipping saliva, and shoved me into the trailer we were unloading.  After I cleaned myself off, I told a supervisor, and this Marine Reservist was disciplined; as of 2014, he doesn't work at Meijer anymore.  Then the supervisor who disciplined him started picking on me; he gave me a 20-minute job out on the floor with water jugs, another 30-40 minutes of stacking more water, then he bitched at me because the whole deal "should have only taken you 20 minutes.  You cold milked the time..." said this tattooed black male who looked like he stepped out of a gangsta rap video, who happened to be my Team Leader now at Meijer.  By September 25, 2013, I quit Meijer and became unemployed again.

If there wasn't all this discrimination about college, tax credits for corporations to outsource the work we need to survive and succeed, and callousness by family and co-workers, my life would be completely different.  Many of you by now may think I am a whiner, but the sad truth is that life in Cincinnati is getting to be hellish.  I am thinking about either New Hampshire (where my cousin now lives) or else the U.S. west of the Mississippi (where two of my cousins now live, plus 8 of the 10 states for best job growth are now out West)...  Wyoming, Arizona, and Texas appeal the most.

Although there are many Millennials who live with their parents in their 20s, and even some Xers like myself who do so in their 30s, I don't want this to continue after I am 40.  There is less of a stigma attached to people who live with their parents, because of the bad economy.  But my parents have done terrible things to me unprovoked, and I am not sure whether to stay or to leave.  If I stay, there is the faint chance I might recover in the next few years, go back to Phoenix by 2017-18, and finish my third undergraduate degree by 2019-20.  By that time, I hope the economy recovers, and that there are enough jobs for people with a college education.  If I leave, it will be what Ayn Rand called "a total break with the world of your past."  I am worried that I will get myself established at a new location for a few months, then lose my job again, then be back to where I started.  Unless, of course, jobs last longer and people are nicer outside of Cincinnati...

Can anyone who is not originally from New Hampshire tell me real-life anecdotes about how New Hampshirites are different from the vile people who inhabit places like Cincinnati?

Thank you for reading this lengthy post, and the favor of your response is requested.
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UCCO2004

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2014, 11:13:54 am »

I should also add that Nevada and California are cool by me also, but each has a few drawbacks:

California is 30% more expensive in cost of living and has bigger government than I'm comfortable living under, even though the California option of legally paying attractive-looking women to star in porno movies with merely average-to-decent-looking me does sound somewhat libertarian. >:D

Nevada has gambling, strip clubs, and legalized prostitution in certain counties, but their housing costs are 20% higher than the U.S. average, and a lot higher than they are in Cincinnati, though the Las Vegas market is supposedly cheaper than before the recession.  Las Vegas unemployment is also around 8.5%, compared to 6.5% in Cincinnati; I've researched the job market there on sites like Indeed.com and found that it may be easier to get a job with associate technical degrees (more companies say they will take you with one), but they do not specify wages and hours in these want ads.  Someone I know in Las Vegas says that you might have to wait at least a year to get a cubicle job with a bachelor's degree, and don't expect higher than $28,000 a year to start. ???  The good thing about Las Vegas is that the I-215 beltway surrounding most of the city is a bit more compact than the I-275 beltway surrounding Cincinnati; commutes in and out of the Downtown/Strip area seem to be shorter than getting downtown in Cincinnati.  I've personally been to Las Vegas (2005) and found it to be more like a beach town; I could envision myself living in a condominium there.
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Planethosting

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2014, 05:35:09 pm »

This is precisely what wrong with America, the complexity and torture that has become your life.  Your parents bought into the lie that has spiritually destroyed them, now they are attempting to cast these spells onto you.  We were not designed to live this European (Roman) lie, we were built, spiritual, physically, mentally, and emotionally to live the lifestyle that the American Indians enjoyed prior to their extermination.

Learn to live very inexpensively and light/mobile (rent a room, easy packing/cleaning clothes, duffle bags, etc, etc - I can help you with this, I'm doing it now), get off the drugs our demonic masters have placed you on, get away from the spiritual vacuum that is your current household. 
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From Babylon, to Samaria, to Egypt, to now Rome, with the aid of The City of London, the District of Columbia, and hooded spirits such as the one they call Lucifer...we are being ruled spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and then physically.  Less so if you understand the true source, nature, and techniques of 'spell casting' by our oppressors.  We are defeated in the spirit realm, first, because many don't believe in the power of, or understand, such things...unlike our rulers, who are the most powerful spiritual organization on the planet, and represent the absolute darkness and proliferation of the occult.

w1LE.e

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2014, 06:15:08 pm »

Well said Planet.
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Then the tears will fly like birds of vengeance.

I'm a drug, alcohol and smoke free linear combination of libertarianism, anarchism, survivalism, agorism and probably other things that has developed as we enter this fourth turning.  Moving to NH for a life of freedom, independence, responsibility and love...love can't be done on its own for me, but I know she's out there.

I've been living so long all by myself, I can't think of living with anybody else
I'm an oyster pearl out of its shell, you better bring that diving bell

Then when our cubs grow, we'll show you what war is good for
One day, I say today we live as a lion.

John Edward Mercier

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2014, 12:39:40 am »

This is precisely what wrong with America, the complexity and torture that has become your life.  Your parents bought into the lie that has spiritually destroyed them, now they are attempting to cast these spells onto you.  We were not designed to live this European (Roman) lie, we were built, spiritual, physically, mentally, and emotionally to live the lifestyle that the American Indians enjoyed prior to their extermination.

Learn to live very inexpensively and light/mobile (rent a room, easy packing/cleaning clothes, duffle bags, etc, etc - I can help you with this, I'm doing it now), get off the drugs our demonic masters have placed you on, get away from the spiritual vacuum that is your current household. 
You do realize that not all Natives lived the same? And that Native traditions don't always fit the scope of our emotional belief?
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UCCO2004

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2014, 06:34:24 pm »

I have to say that I know some people who are of Native American heritage, and most of them are nice people.  The majority I've known are have Cherokee ancestry; it would have been perfect if they would have been granted their own state in the Southeast, before racists like Andrew Jackson controlled our government.  I don't know that many of other tribes, but I read libertarian activist Russell Means' book Where White Men Fear To Tread; I don't agree with everything he says, but he stated that "Libertarian thinking closely parallels the thinking of my [Sioux] culture."
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John Edward Mercier

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2014, 01:55:40 am »

So the Sioux held land as personal property?
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UCCO2004

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2014, 03:04:14 pm »

Notice that he said "closely parallels", not "is exactly like", the culture of the Lakota Sioux.  Russell Means says that he has a hard time accepting the ownership of the Earth as private property, because the Sioux and other Native Americans consider it the Sacred Grandmother of humanity, and that the Earth is made of the bones of your ancestors, so are you comfortable "owning" it?  Of course, my grandparents aren't buried in my backyard, so I don't think the atoms therein are made of such bones, even as we once found something that resembled an Eastern Woodland Indian burial stone on a hike in the woods back there.  But it might be another issue up at the cemetery:  the people who are buried there generally bought the plots, which the cemetery takes care of after they're gone from this Earth.  Certainly, no one in their right mind is going to buy a cemetery made of other people's bones and re-develop it as something else; at least I wouldn't.
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Planethosting

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2014, 03:42:23 pm »

We are made slaves by our rulers.  Mental, emotional, spiritual, and physical slaves, by the very design and intent of our slave masters.  Our rulers are the ones behind the scenes running our government, and churches, and culture.  And their brainwashed/sold-out agents; politicians, educators, priests, pastors, attorneys, judges, police, media, judicial system, business system, etc, etc.  Anyone with great influence, either individually or collectively, is operating within the confines of their system and is your enemy, weather they come as a lamb or a wolf.

Now, the individual citizens are turning as demonic as our rulers, the 'trickle down effect', if you will.  This place is a spiritual toilet filled with pungent misery.  Look around you.  FEEL or SENSE around you.

American Indians were not subjected to any rulers, other than the Great Spirit in the sky, who acted as more of a 'guide' and a grandfather.  We now have demonic idiots making demands of us everywhere we turn - it's called oppression, not what we were designed for, hence our confusion.

It is now all about being told what to do by some entity or individual who has the power to destroy your life, or at least inflict misery upon you.  And with that comes the constant threat of the same, and with that comes the death of us all spiritually = fear.  All in the name of "helping you".  fear is help, war is peace, slavery is freedom.  We have been so debased my our master's spells that we can't tell the difference between good and evil, the truth and a lie.

Here is an example of the reality of our current disgusting spiritual state, that is America, the Great Satan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVKCJklf3oo
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From Babylon, to Samaria, to Egypt, to now Rome, with the aid of The City of London, the District of Columbia, and hooded spirits such as the one they call Lucifer...we are being ruled spiritually, emotionally, mentally, and then physically.  Less so if you understand the true source, nature, and techniques of 'spell casting' by our oppressors.  We are defeated in the spirit realm, first, because many don't believe in the power of, or understand, such things...unlike our rulers, who are the most powerful spiritual organization on the planet, and represent the absolute darkness and proliferation of the occult.

UCCO2004

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Re: Is it libertarian to take Social Security disability?
« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2014, 12:45:20 pm »

I am determined to end this on a positive note.  I got a part-time job as a telephone interviewer that pays better in 25-30 hours than my old, brutally physical job as a truck unloader paid in 32-35 hours. 8)  It is a relatively easy job where I interview people on the telephone, typically in five-hour shifts, and get to take a soda break frequently.  All I really need to know how to do is speak clearly, keep the listener on the other end of the phone interested in what I am saying, and get complete survey data, while entering it into an older Windows or occasionally DOS computer.  Not quite what I trained for in college, but it can be pleasant at times, and it pays the bills.  Because I have this job, my $189-per-month food assistance from the county has been cut, but they will allow me to stay on Medicaid, possibly if I pay a premium as Medicaid buy-in.  [It's good to see that even government is starting to operate on the attitude of TANSTAAFL, and that if I have a job, I need to pay a "user fee" for Medicaid, not just use other people's taxes... even if my parents claim I am just "getting their tax money back"...] 

The great potential of this company is that they might eventually give me more like full-time hours, make me eligible for private health insurance (and not just the 401k benefits I have enrolled in already), and/or promote me to supervisor within the next 1-2 years, since two of my friends at this company started out as interviewers and then got promoted to a supervisory position overseeing 8-10 interviewers in the afternoons and evenings.  The company also gives incentives such as $25 grocery and restaurant cards, but I have already paid it forward by giving my manager a $25 Qdoba card as appreciation for him giving me vacation time near the end of this month.  My manager happens to be a Hispanic man from the Bronx, but he is super-humorous, and said that las comidas mexicanas were greatly appreciated. :)
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